The Mystery of Ben Needham

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Heisenburg on Fri 25 Nov 2016, 9:46 am

Andrew wrote:Will put the Textusa latest which H posted on the other thread here as well:

http://textusa.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/found-lost-likely-and-confession.html#more

Good idea fella.
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  poster on Sat 26 Nov 2016, 8:58 pm

If you apply some of the witness analysis statement techniques as used ih the Kate and Gerryinterviews  to the Ben Needham case, I think it is quite interesting.

Read Kerry's account of the day that Ben went missing in her book. Some things just jump out at me. I will try to find the excerpts from the book but I think they are quite revealing.

http://statement-analysis.blogspot.co.uk/2012/11/statement-analysis-mccann-interview-2011.html


Last edited by poster on Sat 26 Nov 2016, 9:56 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  poster on Sat 26 Nov 2016, 9:49 pm

Andrew wrote:Will put the Textusa latest which H posted on the other thread here as well:

http://textusa.blogspot.co.uk/2016/11/found-lost-likely-and-confession.html#more
:

Snipped from link above:

An English speaking officer told us Barkas had reported seeing a white car parked along the lane on the day Ben had disappeared. He couldn't identify the passengers, but could tell there were two men in the front and a woman in the back.

I wonder who these people were? Perhaps people he might have recognised but couldn't see properly or chose not too?

It was a very hot day - people tend not to hang around in cars in hot countries once they are parked so could these people possibly have been waiting to make sure there were no eye-witnesses?

I wonder if he took note of the number-plates?

I wonder what sort of car/s Ben's family had while out there? I presume they did have a car or several cars as the farmhouse looks quite remote. Kerry worked some distance away and I presume the Ben's grandparents would have needed a car?

In any even, if poor little Ben came to some kind of terrible harm that day (as I do believe) I presume his body would have been removed by vehicle? It is, IMHO, possible that the digger driver perhaps, in the account above, saw who might have been responsible.....

Which might possibly account for the fact that he is now being blamed as the most likely perpetrator of the crime...and because he is dead he cannot protest his innocent or indeed give his version of events which he might have withheld for all sorts of reasons.

ETA: Barkas is obviously a crucial eye-witness....
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Bampots on Sun 27 Nov 2016, 12:36 am

From an article in the Record(courtesy of the Textusa blog!)at the beginning  of this month.....delete if we have this article or indeed if someone has pointed this out befo before please?
In the spirit of speech analysis the last sentences spoken by Eddie are the relevant ones..........

“They have told us to prepare for the worst, they have told us gruesomely how he could have been crushed by a digger.

“But if they do find Ben, it is the end of one nightmare and the beginning of another. It’s a horrible feeling living with this never-ending pain of guilt......

There you have it?



http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/ben-needhams-grandad-did-work-8980373

NEWS
Agony of Ben Needham's grandad as he returns to Kos: 'Did I work on farmhouse foundations at centre of search?'

Eddie Needham is travelling to Kos to look at the concrete foundations under a torn-down building to see if they’re the same ones he worked on a few weeks after Ben went missing


BYLUCY THORNTON
22:11, 4 OCT 2016UPDATED10:17, 5 OCT 2016
Grandad of missing Ben Needham, Eddie Needham is to visit Kos......

Ben Needham ’s grandad says he is returning to Kos because he has to find out what happened to the toddler before he dies.

Eddie Needham, 68, is travelling to the Greek island to speak to British police who have demolished an extension to a farmhouse in their search for the little boy.

ADVERTISING

inRead invented by Teads

The grandad says: “I want answers before I go to my grave”.

The former builder wants to look at the concrete foundations under the torn-down building to see if they’re the same ones he worked on a few weeks after Ben went missing.

The extension, ripped down in 25 minutes by a JCB today, is attached to a farmhouse that Eddie was renovating on the day Ben vanished, July 24, 1991.

He said while he is “nervous” about returning, he is desperate to help solve the 25-year mystery that has plagued his family.

Eddie, from Lincolnshire, told the Daily Mirror: “I feel apprehensive because this feels different from the search in 2012.


Kerry Needham at the farmhouse on Kos where the latest search is concentrated on
Kerry Needham at the farmhouse on Kos where the latest search is focused (Photo: Daily Mirror)
“The police definitely think that Ben is no longer alive. I just think there are things we don’t know.

"I want to look them in the eyes. I believe they have a strong indication that something is amiss.

“They have told us to prepare for the worst, they have told us gruesomely how he could have been crushed by a digger.

“But if they do find Ben, it is the end of one nightmare and the beginning of another. It’s a horrible feeling living with this never-ending pain of guilt.

"This police theory of an accident makes that even worse.”

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Andrew on Sun 27 Nov 2016, 1:15 am

I reckon SYP have a pretty good idea of what happened.

Why all this pussy-footing about like elsewhere is beyond me.
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  poster on Sun 27 Nov 2016, 11:16 pm

Andrew wrote:
Hope wrote:Sorry have to step in here. I was following the case when this website, new facebook page etc was set up. A few people outraged like thousands of others at the way the McCann's were having millions thrown at OG when SYP had no extra resources re Ben case. Kerry had finally agreed to write a book, or rather ghostwritten as all these types of books are inc the bewk. It all started out small, the family had paid for their own searches as much as they could over the yrs, but now they had a lot of people offering help on the Ben page. I remember an auction for small prizes, it def was v basic, people were asking for wristbands, presuming they had them on sale.
The 3 ladies who runs the page for them had it made up and people sugg selling more items. IIRC a business offered to have items made up for free, pens I think not sure.  If you look at the site you can see there were only a few events before SYP grant came through. There were calendars, one page, to print off fo free.
The Fb page is run mainly by a young man, can't remember the name.

There are discrepancies, I believe I pointed some out first, but I am uncomfortable at some of this like saying they love the lime light, I'd say the opposite.

No need to apologise at all, Hope. To be fair it was just me that said they seemed to 'enjoy' the limelight and that was really just going off those recent videos where they appeared to be having fun being the centre of attention whilst at the same time opening up the coffers.

But my honest opinion is that some in that family are in the 'know'. Maybe just one. Maybe all. But as the title of their second documentary - Somebody Knows.

I personally feel that all of them have probably had a better standard of life since Ben vanished than they would've of done if Ben didn't. Just an honest observation and by no means a personal attack but apologies if it comes across that way...


--------

I think there are parallels with the McCann case in terms of the fund-raising and events because I suspect in both cases the families or at least some of the family knew that the children could not be found - so there was a need to prevent the truth from coming out and a need to continue with a lie.

I think the difference is that in the Needham case what happened was a tragic accident. Whereas I think that in the McCann case it was more complicated.

IMO, in both cases, the child died - in the Needham case on the day of the disappearance, in the McCann case, a day or several days prior to the alarm being raised about her disappearance.
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Bampots on Sun 04 Dec 2016, 7:20 pm

Post  these tp keep Ben thread up to date.....

Textusa4 Dec 2016, 16:18:00
Latest news from the FindBenNeedham page:

https://www.facebook.com/helpfindben/posts/1440832012611869

Help Find Ben Needham added 2 new photos.
2 hrs ·

All it takes is ONE person, ONE phone call , ONE anonymous tip sent to South Yorkshire Police. PLEASE help us find Ben and end this horrific torment now. 25 years is too long to hold this secret. WE WONT GIVE UP OR GO AWAY.
#Helpfindben


We would like to highlight the following comments and replies:

Janine Humphries How come there's been no official statement from the police since they came back from Kos
Like · Reply · 2 · 1 hr
Help Find Ben Needham
Help Find Ben Needham They are still getting everything together , shouldn't be long now. There's still plans behind the scenes , don't worry. We aren't going anywhere til Ben is found xx
Like · Reply · 27 · 1 hr · Edited


Louise Chickadee I thought they had given a final answer as to what happens to Ben? Although I never thought it was acceptable or enough for his family.... I thought that they had come the the conclusion he had been accidently killed by that farmer??
Like · Reply · 1 hr
Help Find Ben Needham
Help Find Ben Needham That is the conclusion and we won't give up til Ben is found xx
Like · Reply · 3 · 1 hr
Reply

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  poster on Sun 04 Dec 2016, 7:33 pm

I think what's more likely is that Ben died in an accident - most likely involving the moped.

It is possible than in their panic, the members of the family in the know thought that the digger might assist in some kind of concealment. The digger driver could have been roped in in blissful ignorance and, imo, probably was.

But now he is dead he is a convenient patsy. The digger had some involvement in the aftermath perhaps - even if entirely innocent - so it is convenient to shift the blame onto the digger and makes it slightly less of a lie.

All IMO only of course.

But I think this is how people tend to lie. They find someone or some thing connected in some way and then shift the blame to them.
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Andrew on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 2:09 pm

http://www.itv.com/news/2016-12-12/ben-needham-family-insists-people-do-know-what-happened-to-him/

https://www.thesun.co.uk/uncategorized/2379123/ben-needhams-family-claim-cops-know-kos-locals-can-reveal-what-happened-to-missing-tot-but-are-lying/
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Andrew on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 3:36 pm

A bit more of Kerry and daughter speaking on the video in this link:

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/video-news/video-ben-needhams-family-people-know-what-happened-to-him-35286881.html
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  bluebell on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 4:17 pm

This might be the same link you posted andrew - apologies if so:

http://www.itv.com/goodmorningbritai...-ben-is-buried

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Helenmeg on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 4:42 pm

poster wrote:I think what's more likely is that Ben died in an accident - most likely involving the moped.

It is possible than in their panic, the members of the family in the know thought that the digger might assist in some kind of concealment. The digger driver could have been roped in in blissful ignorance and, imo, probably was.

But now he is dead he is a convenient patsy. The digger had some involvement in the aftermath perhaps - even if entirely innocent - so it is convenient to shift the blame onto the digger and makes it slightly less of a lie.

All IMO only of course.

But I think this is how people tend to lie. They find someone or some thing connected in some way and then shift the blame to them.

Do you think Kerry knows or has it been concealed from her? I'm trying to imagine if just one family member knows... they would be surely weighed down by guilt.
Something odd is going on though. Let's just say imagine that an uncle had an accident on moped and Benn died in the accident. Wouldnt that person e.g uncle be hysterical and go back to family members
in a terrible state... It takes a strange person to keep it under his belt and hide the body... when it is a family member... surely... just dont understand this one. I cfind it hard to believe Kerry KNOWS... unless she has
found out quite recently and has had some time toy reflect and come to a conclusion that it is in everyone's interests to make the digger the key...
Interested to hear others thoughts on this as I'm struggling..
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Châtelaine on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 4:46 pm

IF, I say If, a family member is involved, the best thing would be to throw suspicion on a dead digger...
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Helenmeg on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 4:52 pm

Yes I s'pose so. BUT I just think that all this 'living a lie' must be so exhausting / stressful / debilitating

If the Mc Canns, for example, stood up today and said they were sorry and that this is what happened and they had lied but now wish to come clean... I would forgive them as member of the public.
I find it easy to forgive when people tell the truth..
I absolutely cant stand it when people lie and never come clean but are found out...
If in my life I have told lies or white lies etc etc I have always come clean because it is too hard to live a lie... too much of a burden. Of course if at all possible I dont want to tell porkies anyway... but
I think most people tell white lies at some point... probably and mainly to avoid hurting people or something like that. rendeer
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Helenmeg on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 4:53 pm

Hopefully we can all meet up one day when this is over... and the truth is out.
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Châtelaine on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 4:55 pm

I've never lied in my life, but coming to think of it there may have been 1 or 2 white ones ...

ETA Yes, I hope some of us can meet after all of this is over. I still have a lot of space ... Wink
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Bampots on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 6:51 pm

Something we should never forget is the Macs could be at the centre of something bigger than them.....or sonething that is just way off of what we think happened....and perhaps are not guilty of those things we believe and consequently dont live a lie?

I dont know this to be the case.....but its worth thinking about!!

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  bluebell on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 6:53 pm

I wrote a long (boring) reply to Helenmeg and fortunately lost it Razz
Only to say lying is something I am not able to forgive. It's obviously a personal thing and yes I might have told someone they look good when actually I think they look really ill, but I'm more likely to say 'you aren't looking too good I'm concerned." Is that a white lie?
What happens is what happens - just tell it as it is. I can't trust or tolerate anyone who I find lies to me, even if it was to make me feel better. Although usually it is to make the liar to feel better I've found.
Off topic but that Christie prog. I am watching Timothy Evans lies - he is innocent but he lies and is hanged as a consequence. It's actually why I'm finding it so hard to watch, I want to shout Tell the Truth !! Extreme example of course.
As to the loss of a child by accident - FGS how can anybody do that?
find it quite incomprehensible that someone knows what happened to Ben and hasn't told.
But re: MM, I am sure this has happened, and may they rot in hell for it.
Sorry for O/T and ramble.

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Helenmeg on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 6:58 pm

Something we should never forget is the Macs could be at the centre of something bigger than them.....or sonething that is just way off of what we think happened....and perhaps are not guilty of those things we believe and consequently dont live a lie?

I dont know this to be the case.....but its worth thinking about!! Bampots


Well I believe they were part of a bigger group (not just Tapas 9) and were encouraged and basically ordered to lie and were told it would all be ok and it was for the best. But still they CHOSE to lie and cover up things
in order to save their necks and those of the others. They made a choice. They did not have to lie. And there have been 10 long years in which to come clean - and that applies to the whole lot of them. I think they are cowards... but still - if they told the truth tomorrow I would think more of them...

Anyway - I have gone off topic as this is about Ben
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Bampots on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 8:26 pm

Sorry i led it off topic Helen...it was just the bits about living the lie.

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Helenmeg on Mon 12 Dec 2016, 10:36 pm

Yes and I followed you merrily... Very Happy
But really I will not be surprised if a member of Ben's family was involved in his accidental death ... but wonder how they kept it from the rest of the family
for so long. If that is the case then it must have been someone very immature imo.
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Andrew on Tue 13 Dec 2016, 5:17 am

Updated from ITV:

http://www.itv.com/news/calendar/2016-12-12/ben-needham-family-will-fight-on-to-bring-him-home/

And Andy Lines from the Mirror:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/ben-needhams-mum-claims-villagers-9444737
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Andrew on Tue 13 Dec 2016, 6:00 am

Helenmeg wrote:Yes and I followed you merrily... Very Happy
But really I will not be surprised if a member of Ben's family was involved in his accidental death ... but wonder how they kept it from the rest of the family
for so long. If that is the case then it must have been someone very immature imo.

Personally, I think it's rather telling that Grandpa Eddie has been omitted from all the sofa business for a long time now.

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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Andrew on Tue 13 Dec 2016, 7:52 am

Transcript of the Good Morning stuff (thanks to Textusa as nicked it from there)

Textusa12 Dec 2016, 21:13:00

This is our transcript of the vídeo. We ask readers for transcription errors to be pointed out for correction:

Good Morning Britain, with Piers Morgan and Susanna Reid – December 12th 2016

Needham family plead for information about where Ben is buried

“The family of missing British toddler Ben Needham say they’ll spend the first Christmas in decades coming to terms with the knowledge that he will never be found alive.

In a moment, his mum, Kerry Needham, his sister, Leighanna and his grandmother, Christine join us for the first time since the police operation on the Greek island of Kos finally came to an end.

Let’s recap with Keira Durkan.

Voice-over (VO): “More than 25 years after Ben vanished, and 300 reported sightings of the toddler, this September South Yorkshire Police began excavations on the family’s former holiday home in Greece, close to where he was last seen in 1991. The search was prompted by information that he may have been killed in an accident involving a digger.”

September video of Kerry Needham speaking: “It’s not the best solution but it will eventually, you know, lay it to rest for us. We’re all, we’re all extremely tired and distressed.”

VO: “For 3 weeks, the 19- strong team, in painstakingly unearthed 93 items of interest. The day before the search was due to end, they found a toy car. His mother confirmed it was his, leading the police to conclude that Ben died on the day he disappeared.”

DCI Cousins “They’ve had 25 years wanting an answer in relation to this and this is the answer that we are able to give them- at this stage.”

Piers Morgan (PM): “Well, Ben’s mother Kerry, grandmother Christine and sister Leighanna are here with us. Thank you, all of you, for coming here today. Look, it’s a heart- breaking story that we’ve been following for 25 years. You’ve been living it because Ben is your boy. Let me ask you a difficult question, because I saw the passion and emotion that you’ve been showing about this- the government should be doing more- what more can they do, given that we all got our hopes raised, yours in particular, that we may be able to get to the bottom of this. It didn’t happen. What more can they physically do that they’re not doing, do you think?”

Kerry Needham (KN): “We know for a fact that erm, there is people on Kos that know what happened to Ben that day. The police have got witness statements from some people. We still believe that there is other people on the island that know where he is.”

PM: “But it may be that the key person is now dead and therefore you’ll never be able to ask the key question of potentially the key witness, if that is the case.”

KN: “We have, we have been assured really, by South Yorkshire Police, that people do know, they do know but they’ve lied.”

PM: “Other people?”

KN: “Other people. Yes, on the island.”

Christine Needham (CN): “Yeah, also, there is one other guy who was with the digger driver that day who swears he was with him 24/7, 24/7… quotes - I was his banksman. I was this, I never left his side, we went to lunch together- They didn’t go to lunch together at all because our police have checked.”


PM: “So you think there are people still alive who are lying?”

CN: “Yes, there’s at least one person, yes absolutely, yes.”

Susanna Reid (SR): “Christine, you were the last person to see Ben alive (C –yes) weren’t you?

CN: “Yes”

SR: “What do you believe happened? What was he doing at that moment and what do you think happened after that?”

CN: “I can’t comprehend it, I just can’t because it’s such a relaxing place, here, you’ve got your holiday brain on.. I can’t ..”

SR: “Was he just playing?”

CN “Yes, just playing, just playing outside, I mean in an area where there was no traffic, there’s no more children, where there’s no animals. Where, I mean, the machine digger when I went over there, there wasn’t a machine digger. People think we.. I took Ben to a building site. I did not.

Leighanna Needham (LN): “Bearing in mind that we are talking about a completely different era as well.”

CN: “Yeah”

LN: “…it was the 1990s and these sort of things were completely unheard of.”

CN: “Yeah. Of course I let them him play outside, we wouldn’t let him play outside in Sheffield.

PM: “Do you? . Let me ask you another hard question. Do you accept, as a family, that Ben is dead?”

CN: “Yes”

PM: “You’ve come to terms with that?”

CN: “Yes, well, we’ve not come to terms… ( K we’re trying ..)

PM “You’ll never really come to terms with it ..

CN: “We know it’s the truth.”

PM: “But you’ve come to terms with the fact that he is dead?”


CN: “Yes, we know it’s the truth.”

PM: “And now it’s about being able to find his body?”(Yes) and bring him home (Yes)”

KN: “He deserves that..”

CN: “He deserves that, why.. .”

KN: “He does deserve that.. we deserve it, .”

CN: “We’re not asking very much, do you know what I mean? And we’ve never gone, poor us, poor us. We don’t do that, we just get on with it and we’re focused. But it’s time somebody just gave us a bit of respect, do you know, just a little…”

KN: “We’ve got to keep the investigation going. We’ve got to stay strong.”

CN: “Yeah, there is at least one person knows.”

PM: “The police have said that the investigation is not closed (CN – yes, not closed, both say yes and nod) and they are continuing and I mean the police, let’s be fair to the police here (Yes, absolutely) they’ve done an amazing job trying, trying to give you what you want (CN – yes they have) ( and more) and it’s a difficult investigation so long after the event. Leighanna, you’re all so passionate and eloquent about this, it’s obviously heart- rending for you as a family, but if you want the government to do more, what is it you want them to do now?”

LN: “To put pressure onto the Greek authorities as Ben is a British citizen and that British passport says that he is protected now, whether he is alive or whether he is no longer alive, he should still be protected as a British citizen and my mum needs answers. She’s lived this for 25 years and a lot of it unnecessarily. I’ve been brought up into it all and it’s not an easy thing to do, it’s not an easy thing to watch your family every day, never knowing how they’re going to be.”

SR: “And this is a little boy that you never knew.”

LN: “I never knew, exactly. And now, my little girl, I’ve got a little girl of my own and she’s at the same age. I couldn’t imagine having to go through what these guys have been through and what I’ve had to sort of witness over the years, I wouldn’t wish that on Hermione. I couldn’t do that to her and put her.. see her go through that.”

PM: “Kerry, you’ve been inundated with the public support ( Yeah absolutely) What would you like to say to everyone who’s been rooting for you?”

KN: “Amazing. Thank you. We, I don’t actually think we could have done it without them, you know, just the support they’ve shown, the messages we have had from everybody. It really has given us drive and strength, to know that we’re not alone and out there… erm, unbelievable. It is actually unbelievable, I never expected it, to be quite honest. I know there’s a lot of people out there that are sort of saying they don’t believe this is what’s happened. We do. The police have got that, hold that information, they wouldn’t have told us that if that’s not what they thought. We just need them to and people to keep continuing supporting us, you know try and like Leighanna said, we need pressure still on the Greek police and the Greek authorities to keep this active and open. There are people on Kos that know what happened and probably know where Ben is buried.”

SR: “You want to put him to rest?”

KN: “Absolutely”

SR: “And you want your minds put at rest?”(KN nods) about exactly what happened on that day?”

CN: “Definitely”

KN: ”Yeah”

PM: “Kerry, Christine and Leighanna, thank you so much and all the best with what happens.”
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Re: The Mystery of Ben Needham

Post  Andrew on Sat 17 Dec 2016, 2:59 pm

http://www.itv.com/news/calendar/2016-12-17/greek-television-show-appeals-again-for-information-over-ben-needham/
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