Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

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Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 8:22 am

On JH Miss Beetle posted some time ago that the wording concerning the care of Maddie  in a few rogatories was virtually identical.

i came across this one by Andrew which has many points of interest.

It's next to impossible to higlight the relevant parts on iPad so would be great if the author checks  Very Happy
So that the statement analysis is clear to see?


Leicestershire Police Force

Statement by Sharon LEWIN

Occupation: Teaching Assistant

This statement (2 pages) is truthful in accordance with my understanding.

Date: 21st April 2008

I am the person referred to above and I work as a teaching assistant at Laurels Nursery School, Melton Road, Queniborough, Leicestershire. The nursery school has the capacity to receive about 80 children full-time, aged between 6 weeks and 5 years and is open from 07.30 to 18.00 daily. The children are grouped according to age and I work in the section that looks after children aged between two and half and three years old. I have worked at the nursery for five years and I am currently on maternity leave.

I got to know Madeleine and her parents Kate and Gerry through my work at the nursery school. Madeleine started at the nursery when she was about two years old. About 2 years old. Any exact dates when she started?

When she was two and a half she joined the group supervised by me, I think it was in 2006, and she remained there for about 6 months. Where did she go after about 6 months? So she went somewhere else when she was 3 then? Where? Madeleine attended on Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays. Did Kate work Mondays and Friday's then?

She would be dropped off between 08.00 and 08.30 and would return home at about 17.00. The dropping off and picking up was taken in turns by the parents and as a result of this Kate and Gerry asked me to take care of the children during the evening on some occasions. Is that common practice to ask your child's nursery teacher to babysit out of work hours too? Kate would pick Madeleine up from the nursery at the end of the day and I would accompany them to their house. We would have tea and I would help give Madeleine her bath. Nursery teacher bathing M as well? Is she getting paid for all this? Where are the Twins?

Kate and Gerry would go out and I would watch a DVD with the girl before telling her a bedtime story. Would you really sit and watch a dvd with a 2 and a half / 3 year old in the eve? Where are the twins?

I think I did this about 5 times and on each occasion it was at their home in Rothley.

I always think of Madeleine as an alert and affectionate girl who liked to live.Liked to live?? She was very advanced for her age and independent. She liked to dance and to dress up. What's all this advanced for her age that everyone harps on about? Dress up as in make up too?

Kate and Gerry were always very friendly to me. I am quite close to both of them She just said above she only went to the house 5 times? Close to both of them? and they were always kind and generous Money generous?. I am probably a bit closer to Kate who would sometimes send me text messages and I would take my baby along to visit her and have coffee. So who was looking after your baby while you were out looking after MBM?

I consider her to be a good friend. A good friend. Your paid to look after toddlers. You get roped in by kate to occasionally work in the evenings, 5 you say and she's now a good friend?

I never saw Madeleine have any problem or conflict with her parents, family members or friends. Of course you wouldn't if she is now a good friend? When did you see MBM with other family members?

I would describe them as a charming family who loved each other. Over egging that a bit? The twins adored their older sister and Kate and Gerry would often play with the children. Often play with the children. Really... the parents often played with there own children. Well i never..

Madeleine felt comfortable at the nursery school, she had many friends and got on well with the other children. Will have to take your word on that i guess.

Madeleine was quite a healthy girl. Quite a healthy girl? She had a good appetite and ate well. I don't remember any injury or accident. She would occasionally have a small scrape at the nursery but nothing abnormal. During the six months she was under my care she was absent five times because of being unwell, but they were just small colds with a high temperature. You sure they were just small colds?

At the nursery medication could only be administered by the senior members of staff and with the agreement of the children's parents. The only medication that I recall Madeleine taking was Calpol to lower her temperature.

Madeleine never complained about her family or friends What 2 and a half, 3 year old would complain about her family or friends? and as I have already stated I consider them to be a charming family. Charming? That word again. She loved her mother and father Why would she not? and always knew who would pick her up from the nursery ad was always anxious for that moment. Gerry and Kate never appeared to have any problems in dealing with Madeleine.Again now there your good friends, then you would say that? We would have regular meetings with the parents at the nursery and they never expressed any worry in relation to Madeleine's behaviour.

Madeleine was a very active child but I would not call her hyperactive. She never got over excited and always had good behaviour. Does that not contradict what other family members have stated? Madeleine was easy to look after, a very independent girl Just how independent is a 2 and a half, 3 year old but she never placed herself in dangerous situations, as far as I saw.

Occasionally during the afternoon, some of the children would have a siesta in the dormitory but Madeleine never did. I had the opportunity to be present at her bedtime when I looked after her. Bath time was at about 18.30 - 19.00 and she would later go to bed at about 19.30 – 20.00 I would read her a story or two and she would always fall asleep half way through. Fall's asleep like clockwork then. Just like in Portugal?

Gerry and Kate would normally return home at about 22.30 and before this I would check whether she was all right, by looking around the bedroom door. What? doing an Oldfield? Not stepping foot inside the room? I do not have knowledge of the girl waking up after she fell asleep. You wouldn't do unless you stayed the night next to her?

This statement was made by me and is truthful in accordance
Unquote

Comments on the distancing language?   The girl ....

The other thing that strikes me that 5 absences in six months, all involving high temperatures  does not describe a healthy or even 'quite healthy'  child.



Last edited by Tigger on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 8:39 am; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Andrew on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 8:37 am

Nice one for bringing that over Tigger.

I remember starting that thread over on the other place and saw it was 'bumped' recently.

Some odd remarks there.

My blue comments for those who never saw my original post.


Last edited by Andrew on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 8:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Antonia on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 8:48 am

Isn't there a contradiction between 'easy to look after' and 'very independent'. You are talking about a child who is between 2 and a half and 3 when this witness is involved with her. Not an age when you can discuss things rationally with a child!

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 11:10 am

04-Carta Rogatoria - Depoimentos 1, Pages 1 to 2

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Leicestershire Constabulary
Witness Statement

CJ Act 1967, s.9; MC Act 1980, ss.5'(3) e 5B; Regular Criminal Process 2005, Decision 27.1

Statement of: Amanda Jane COXON
Age if less than 18:

This statement (consisting of 2 pages and signed by me) is true to the best of my knowledge and belief and I make it knowing that, if it is tendered in evidence, I shall be liable to prosecution if I have wilfully stated in it anything I know to be false or do not believe to be true.

Date: 02 May 2008
Signature _________________________________________

I am a friend of Gerry and Kate, I used to work for them and also looked after the children.

I got to know Gerry and Kate in the year 2000, I worked as a cleaner in their house in Queniborough, once a week. From the beginning they were always a very friendly couple.

During the time I worked there, Kate had her first daughter, Madeleine. Kate asked me whether I would look after Madeleine twice a week when she returned to work part time. I agreed and she would leave Madeleine at my house and come and pick her up later in the day.

Kate, Gerry and Madeleine moved to Amsterdam for a year and when they returned Kate was pregnant with the twins. The twins were born in February 2006 and from that time I helped to look after them.

The relationship I had with Gerry and Kate turned into friendship over the years and I consider myself to be a good friend of Kate's. After their return from Portugal we became very close.

Gerry is a person with his feet very firmly placed on the ground, a pleasant person who made us feel welcome from the very beginning. He is very conscientious with regard to his work but also loves his family very much. He adores the children and would often have fun rolling about on the floor with Madeleine.

Kate is also a very friendly person, she is calm and serene and also adores the children. I never heard her raise her voice with Madeleine or become irritated with her.

I have no knowledge of any conflict between Kate and Gerry, or between them and Madeleine. I do not know of any problem or conflict between Madeleine and any other person or child.

I had a good relationship with Madeleine, I would describe her as full of fun, intelligent for her age and very active. She is a very happy girl and the last time I saw her, she was already capable of maintaining a conversation. She clearly understood the instructions given to her and was a good listener.

I would say that Madeleine is a very healthy girl and I never noticed any changes in behaviour. I would not describe her as a hyperactive child. I do not know of any problem related to sleeping, but I was rarely present when she went to bed.

Kate and Gerry never mentioned having any type of problem with Madeleine.
She was well behaved, never caused her parents any problems and apparently always understood what she was told. The parents never looked tired of taking care of Madeleine.

I have no knowledge about whether Madeleine was subject to taking medicine and I never saw anyone giving her any medication. Gerry and Kate never referred to any medication that Madeleine was taking.

As I said before, Madeleine was a very well behaved and lively child.

With relation to the question about haemorrhages, I was never present at any episode when Madeleine bled, other than a normal nose bleed when she inserted her finger into her nose and bled.

Nothing different from any other child having a nose bleed.(Why the no nosebleed story? - )

In my opinion, Kate and Gerry and the children are a happy family who enjoy having fun together. There are no words to describe what happened last year and they do not deserve to have been treated in the way they have been, by the community and by the press. They are two decent and hardworking people who are devoted to their children.

This statement was made by me and is truthful according to my understanding.

unquote with thanks to McCannfiles.com

So now we have two people - this one allegedly the cleaner! Both attesting to the non hyper active nature of Maddie, the robust health, except for.. the list is getting longer. No nosebleeds except when she made them happen, only about one episode of slight cold with high fever, nothing to worry about and no health records anywhere.
Off you go Andrew! I'm looking for the next one.
I believe she is married to a paediatrician, which makes it unlikely that she worked as a cleaner. However, if TM wasn't too keen to divulge the number of other carers employed to look after Maddie, it makes more sense.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 11:25 am

So Madeleine is in nursery for at least three full days a week and then left with a babysitter in the evenings too. Doesn't sound like she saw much of her parents at all.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 11:33 am

Statement of: Linda Ruth McQUEEN
Age if less than 18:
Occupation: Teacher

This statement (consisting of 2 pages and signed by me) is true to the best of my knowledge and belief and I make it knowing that, if it is tendered in evidence, I shall be liable to prosecution if I have wilfully stated in it anything I know to be false or do not believe to be true.

Date: 07 May 2008
Signature _________________________________________

I am the person referred to above living at the address previously supplied to the police of Leicestershire. I was questioned about my friendship with the McCann and the Healy families as well as my visits to Portugal during the Summer of 2007.

During my childhood I lived with my mother in the same street as Brian and Susan Healy, who are the parents of Kate. I have known Kate since 6 months of age and my mother and hers are still great friends today. We went to the same school even though I was 6 years older than Kate. We continued our friendship during school and into adulthood.

Kate met Gerry while at university about 13 or 14 years ago and they married about 10 years ago. They have 3 children, Madeleine almost 5 years of age and twins, Sean and Amelie, who are 3 years old. In October 1998 my husband and I had our daughter, Ellie, and Kate and Gerry married at Christmas that same year. Kate and Gerry adored Ellie, both desired children. Kate wanted to have a tribe of 6 or 7. When Kate became pregnant with Madeleine it was a great event for them, given that Kate had faced problems with conceiving. After the birth of Madeleine the family moved to Amsterdam so that Gerry could continue his professional training. While they were there Kate received IVF treatment and became pregnant with the twins. It was a difficult pregnancy but Sean and Amelie were born healthy in February 2006. Before the disappearance of Madeleine last year, Mark and I used to see Kate, Gerry and the family approximately every two months, we went to Leicester or they came to Liverpool.

On the morning of 4 May 2007 Kate's mother telephoned my mother who, in turn, telephoned me. My mother told me that something terrible had happened, that somebody had taken Madeleine. I later sent a text message to Kate that same night and I spoke with her on the telephone. She was hysterical, saying only that she wanted to be able to hug Madeleine. She was worried by the fact that there were only two police officers in the place and thought that the police were not helping her with anything. She continued to speak about Madeleine, of the cold that she could feel since she was dressed only in pyjamas and continued to look at the situation from the perspective of Madeleine. She told me that Gerry was outside to find the girl and during the following day we spoke on the telephone and we frequently sent messages [to each other].

On Saturday I spoke on the telephone with Gerry who was sobbing and we decided that I would go to Portugal as soon as Nicky Gill and Michelle Thompson returned home, to replace them and to render assistance. During 2007 I travelled to Portugal on 3 separate occasions:

12 - 19 May, 26 - 29 June, and 19 - 26 August.

On the first occasion I caught the same flight as the priest Paul Seddon and we arrived on Saturday night. We went straight to the apartment where Kate and Gerry were at supper, Gerry embraced us and Kate was crying. We remained for some time and Kate repeated "where is she? Who has her?" I felt that Kate and Gerry were focused on the idea to find Madeleine in their own way, and the local police had not progressed. I stayed in a separate room in the apartment of Kate and Gerry during all my stay. I helped in the attempt to keep the daily routine of the twins, namely in taking them to the day-care centre. Gerry and Kate always returned for lunch and took the children to afternoon tea in the attempt to give a semblante of normality. Kate and Gerry were involved in innumerable interviews with the press and the police all day, but they arranged [their] availability to always give attention to the twins, namely the bath before sleep. During it we would speak about how things had gone during the day and make plans for the following day.

During the first week that I was in Portugal Kate and Gerry were transported [driven] by representatives of Mark Warner. Sandy Cameron was also there and possessed a hire car, but it was not the Renault Scenic that Gerry and Kate rented during the third week that I stayed with them in Portugal.

In the second week that I was there, I travelled [to Portugal] with Nicky Gill. We stayed with Trish and Sandy in the apartment close to Kate and Gerry. On this occasion Gerry drove a hire car but I do not remember if it was the previous car of Sandy or the Renault scenic.

In the third week I travelled [to Portugal] with my husband, Mark, our daughter Ellie and the priest Paul Seddon. Ellie and I stayed in the Villa that Kate and Gerry had rented, Paul and Mark stayed in an apartment in the immediate vicinity. During this period both Kate and Gerry drove the Renault Scenic and I travelled frequently in that vehicle.

With respect to rooms where I stayed, I noticed nothing strange. With respect to the hire vehicles, I noticed nothing strange in any of them; never was there a disagreeable or intense [sharp] smell. We frequently used the boot of the vehicles to place the things of the children and ours, given that there were two child's chairs in the rear section that left no extra space.

There is no way Kate and Gerry could have hidden Madeleine and carried her body inside the car to an unknown place. They are both devoted parents and it is incomprehensible that they would have [deliberately] hurt Madeleine. As far as I know, Gerry and Kate were never alone given that the press followed them everywhere, and would not have had a chance to do it [transport the body]. Also, I think that it would have been impossible for Madeleine to have left the apartment by herself.

Since Kate and Gerry returned to the United kingdom, we have kept contact through written messages almost daily. I visit them in Leicester once in a while and they also have visited us. I have a mobile phone with the number xxxxxxxxxx that I use to contact Kate and Gerry. This telephone is with the O2 service provider. My husband Mark has one with the number xxxxxxxxxx with the Orange service provider. At home we have a fixed telephone with the number xxxxxxxxx.

This statement was made by me and is truthful according to my understanding.
unquote

The paragraph above is full of instructions by TM: I rather like ''carried her body inside the car to an unknown place.'' As opposed to outside the car to a known place? Curious phrasing.
She also clears the boot of the car of any smell or untoward cargo. Not even nappies.
Yet Michael Wright must have lost that bit of the TM instructions when he gave (probably out of date instructions that lingered from the early days) the rotting meat and garbage explanation.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 11:35 am

Nicky Gill:

With regard to the car hired by Kate and Gerry, it was a Renault Scenic, but I think that they only had it when I travelled to Portugal for the last time. I would be transported in the car daily, given that the villa was located outside of the resort. There was nothing strange about the car, I never noticed any unusual odour. There was no way in which Kate and Gerry could have hidden Madeleine and then have transported her body to another place. They were never alone and had the worlds press literally camped at their door.

Kate and Gerry never placed the children at risk and I know that they adored Madeleine and the twins, because they both very much wanted to have children. They both loved their children, Madeleine meant everything to Kate and in my opinion they are both excellent parents, totally devoted to their children.

Michelle Thompson:

Kate and Gerry never put their children at risk and they adored Madeleine and the twins. Both love their children and Madeleine represented everything to Kate and in my opinion, they are both excellent parents and totally devoted to their children.

Not so different from Linda McQueen's either, with the car: 'There is no way' - etc.


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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 11:37 am

This GP has been their GP for the last 14 months in April 2008, so only was their GP for two months prior to Madeleine's disappearance. He only mentions the twins however.

http://themaddiecasefiles.com/topic474.html

CARTAS ROGATORIAS UK (FILE 3) Page 3

Testimony from Ian Richard Schofield 14 May 2008
3—Witness statement of Ian Richard Schofield (Dr. at Alpine Practice) 2008.05.14
Testimony of: Ian Richard SCHOFIELD
Age is less than 18 years:
Occupation: Physician (General Practice)
This deposition (comprising 1 page and signed by me) is true and according to my understanding. I am aware that, if proven to the contrary, I will be subject to prosecution if I have voluntarily testified to something with
knowledge of it being false or not corresponding to the truth.
Date: May 14, 2008
Signature ______________________________________

I am a GP and senior partner in Alpine Practice in Rothley Road, Mountsorrel and in summary my qualifications are respectively at MBChB, DRCOG, MRCGP.
I am currently, and have been for 14 months, the GP of the McCann family. Before Madeleine's disappearance, I had only consulted Kate McCann once and never had assisted Gerry, nor ever had reason to deal with the twins Sean and Amelie and only saw them once after the disappearance of Madeleine.
As Kate and Gerry are general practitioners I never had any doubt about their capacity or mental abilities as individuals or as parents to their three children.
I never prescribed Kate or Gerry any medication that could alter their behaviour or demeanour.
I never had any doubt about the psychological welfare of the children.
The only thing I can affirm is that Kate and Gerry are a very genuine couple, affectionate and careful [caring] parents. They always kept me, social services and other authorities informed on the progress of the investigation that followed the disappearance of Madeleine.
After the disappearance of Madeleine, I met Kate and Gerry at their home and never had any cause for concern about the twins.
This testimony was prepared from a series of questions raised by DC Ferguson and DC Holliday of the Leicestershire police, following the request by the Portuguese PJ.
This testimony was made by me and it is true according to my understanding.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 11:41 am

And here, just to keep it all together, is the comment from the creche worker in Amsterdam, someone who clearly had no instructions .... Very Happy

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t9280-controversy-about-amsterdam-stay?highlight=amsterdam

Part of the translation from above link: from a creche worker.

I believe that she had no work here. But I'm not absolutely sure. It's so many years ago.
As far as Maddy is concerned I remember her as a quiet girl who was rather sad from time to time, but that is not so strange at that age. On the whole she was always easily soothed if you came to sit by her or if you got some toys or a little book and sat next to her. But I do know of plenty of kids who are perfectly happy in the creche and terrorise home life.
Kate came - for me - always over as very stressed and I suspected even then that she had Post Natal depression.
She could come in with an icy look and would barely react to the group, other parents or us.
As if she wasn't really there (Hence the suspected depression)
[/size]Sometimes her interaction with Maddy was very noticable. She certainly made the expression 'dumping your kid in the creche' come to life. Just Hello and Goodbye


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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Justformaddiemccann on Sat 04 Oct 2014, 12:54 pm

Tigger wrote:And here, just to keep it all together, is the comment from the creche worker in Amsterdam, someone who clearly had no instructions .... Very Happy

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t9280-controversy-about-amsterdam-stay?highlight=amsterdam

Part of the translation from above link: from a creche worker.

I believe that she had no work here. But I'm not absolutely sure. It's so many years ago.
As far as Maddy is concerned I remember her as a quiet girl who was rather sad from time to time, but that is not so strange at that age. On the whole she was always easily soothed if you came to sit by her or if you got some toys or a little book and sat next to her. But I do know of plenty of kids who are perfectly happy in the creche and terrorise home life.
Kate came - for me - always over as very stressed and I suspected even then that she had Post Natal depression.
She could come in with an icy look and would barely react to the group, other parents or us.
As if she wasn't really there (Hence the suspected depression)
[/size]Sometimes her interaction with Maddy was very noticable. She certainly made the expression 'dumping your kid in the creche' come to life. Just Hello and Goodbye




Ohh, well spotted tigger affraid

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  PMR on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 12:32 am

Re Sharron Lewins statement , I know a few nursery nurses who baby sit for the children some evenings. The children know them , the parents know they are ( or should be ) trustworthy. The nursery assistant knows where they are going and it's a chance to earn extra cash in a career that is notoriously under paid
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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 7:57 am

PMR wrote:Re Sharron Lewins statement , I know a few nursery nurses who baby sit for the children some evenings. The children know them , the parents know they are ( or should be ) trustworthy. The nursery assistant knows where they are going and it's a chance to earn extra cash in a career that is notoriously under paid


That isn't the point really. It's the fact that KM seemed to have rather a lot of helpers with childcare and the curious omission of the twins from most of the above statements.

The other points being that some of the allegedly personal statements are worded exactly the same which indicates instructions on exactly what to answer to certain questions. Imo

Then we have a GP giving testimony as to the treatment of their children although no mention is made of Maddie and he has only been their GP for two months by 3/7/07.

It's also rather strange that a cleaner (who is married to a paediatrician) looks after Maddie.

Furthermore, the descriptions of Maddie are curious and contradictory if other statements concerning her from the family are also taken into account.

One thing that's always bothered me is that I've never seen a photograph of Kate with Maddie on her lap, say aged 2 or 3. At that age they're so cuddlesome - might that be because there simply isn't one?

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  PMR on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 9:14 am

I thought you were asking is it acceptable practice for nursery staff to babysit for their charges. Crossed wires
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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Antonia on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 9:54 am

I agree with tigger. odd that the wife of a paediatrician (high status, high paid job) does parttime cleaning which is regarded as unskilled work and done by working class people. not meaning to be snobby here this is the reality. Cleaning is not normally well paid so why would a professional's wife do such work. helping with childminding is different. If you like children its great work.
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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 11:32 am

PMR wrote:I thought you were asking is it acceptable practice for nursery staff to babysit for their charges. Crossed wires

Sorry, early in the morning and on iPad mini it's really time consuming to post. No, if you look at what they are actually saying, it seems they did not in fact have much to do with Maddie imo, Lewin for 6 months and Maddie had 5'small colds with high temperature'  what does that tell you?  That she  was very healthy?

What is very important imo is that Maddie's health records were refused when the PJ asked for them very early on and seem never to have been released.
Then their GP just gave the McCanns a glowing reference without ever mentioning Maddie.

There were questions put to Gerry about nosebleeds, nosebleeds figure in these statements too.

For myself, going by the photographs alone,  I am convinced she was ill and had to have some kind of treatment.
Kate refers twice in the diary of Maddie and her fear of pain. She changes this in the book to 'fear and pain' -
I think she wasn't 'right' from the day she was born. The two 'mother and baby' photographs show Kate at a much younger  age and pasting  a black bar in an eye doesn't make the baby Madeleine.

The photograph in the book hardly shows the baby at all which is surely what could be expected from mother and new born baby.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 11:38 am

Antonia wrote:I agree with tigger. odd that the wife of a paediatrician (high status, high paid job) does parttime cleaning which is regarded as unskilled work and done by working class people. not  meaning to be snobby here this is the reality. Cleaning is not normally well paid so why would a professional's wife do such work. helping with childminding is different. If you like children its great work.

Kate also phoned Amanda on the night of the 3rd/4th. Which would be strange if it were the cleaner but understandable if Amanda looked after Maddie a lot. i'll try and find the time she phoned.

It wouldn't look good if the PJ found that Kate had a bevy of nannies when she only worked two half days a week I believe. It would explain why the McCanns were apparently broke by the time Maddie disappeared. Even the family have told us this.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  travis macbickle on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 12:22 pm

Great work Tigger.The comments from the creche worker in Amsterdam speaks volumes IMO.
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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Antonia on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 4:41 pm

Tigger wrote:
Antonia wrote:I agree with tigger. odd that the wife of a paediatrician (high status, high paid job) does parttime cleaning which is regarded as unskilled work and done by working class people. not  meaning to be snobby here this is the reality. Cleaning is not normally well paid so why would a professional's wife do such work. helping with childminding is different. If you like children its great work.

Kate also phoned Amanda on the night of the 3rd/4th. Which would be strange if it were the cleaner but understandable if Amanda looked after Maddie a lot. i'll try and find the time she phoned.

It wouldn't look good if the PJ found that Kate had a bevy of nannies when she only worked two half days a week I believe.  It would explain why the McCanns were apparently broke by the time Maddie disappeared. Even the family have told us this.

well i wouldn't think badly of someone who had a lot of childcare help when they had three very small children. madeleine wasn't two when the twins arrived. You need help and only working parttime doesn't change the need IMO. agree though, lots of nannies could be costly, especially when added to large mortgage, 2 car loans etc.add up
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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Tue 07 Oct 2014, 8:55 pm

Ah yes, but the image projected for the PJ and the media was of a devoted mother, not one who needed several nannies.
Three small children would be hell, but imo Maddie spent a lot of time with the McCanns in Glasgow.
Kate herself has said that the twins didn't have much to do with her, early on in an interview.
Makes sense.
But imagine no nanny and three children to take care of by herself on holiday.

I don't think they ever coped with Maddie on her own, all three of them (Kate, Gerry and Maddie) crying in the kitchen  - in the book.
Perhaps, unlike the statements of the nannies above, she was not an easy child. A screamer, could throw a tantrum, are the words of Grandma McCann.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Tue 06 Jan 2015, 8:05 am

Btw:  the blue comments in the first post are those of Miss Beetle.

Whilst we're on the subject: where is Miss Beetle? 

The rogatories confirm once again that much of the damage control was the work of TM with a bit of help from the likes of Woolfall (reputation management) and other professional liars PR experts.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Helenmeg on Tue 06 Jan 2015, 9:48 am

Very very interesting thread.

In one of the first statements listed above - it states:

She continued to speak about Madeleine, of the cold that she could feel since she was dressed only in pyjamas and continued to look at the situation from the perspective of Madeleine. She told me that Gerry was outside to find the girl and during the following day we spoke on the telephone

This, to me, indicates that Kate (Team Mc Cann) wanted to ensure the world believed that M disappeared in her PJs - whereas she probably did not - and the clothes were disposed of perhaps because of blood etc.


It seems that all the people who gave the statements were handpicked by Team Mc Cann in order to present Kate as a serene calm mother and M as a perfectly happy and well-behaved child. Thus we could deduce that Kate was not a serene and calm mother and M was not an easy child. This equates with the statement from the Creche worker in Amsterdam which sounds far more likely.

Any investigation reading the creche worker from Amsterdam's statement and the rest would surely see some red warning lights..cheers


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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Mon 25 May 2015, 9:46 pm

Rachel Mampilly,just seen this mentioned on twitter,was it mentioned by any one else.

The window shutters of the McCann's apartments were closed. The patio door that they used to enter the apartment also had its shutter closed. In order to enter they had to raise the shutter.


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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  candyfloss on Mon 25 May 2015, 9:53 pm

caricature wrote:Rachel Mampilly,just seen this mentioned on twitter,was it mentioned by any one else.

The window shutters of the McCann's apartments were closed. The patio door that they used to enter the apartment also had its shutter closed. In order to enter they had to raise the shutter.


I remember posting this on the other forum, that the shutters were down, and also the curtains closed. Can't imagine how they got in if that was the case? scratch IIRC only RM mentioned it - no one else.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Mon 25 May 2015, 9:55 pm

Thanks Candyfloss,first time I'd seen it mentioned.

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Re: Rogatories relating to Maddie's care

Post  Guest on Mon 25 May 2015, 9:57 pm

candyfloss wrote:

 Can't imagine how they got in if that was the case? scratch  

Front door as per first statements?

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