PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  poster on Wed 01 Aug 2018, 11:46 pm

For those of us who have followed this case for a long time - isn't it great to move into a space where we can say things without 'hurting feelings' and also without 'super-duper mega injunctions' etc?

The 'hurt feelings' scenario in this particular context does make your mind do a lot of gymnastics.

How can people be so duplicitous? It scrambles your mind. I do believe the Portuguese police were somewhat scrambled...and who can blame them?

I used to work in the MSM and I was always astonished by what they got away with.
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  candyfloss on Thu 02 Aug 2018, 10:39 am

poster wrote:Brilliant. Dr Robert's is so perceptive and a great writer.

Madeleine was not reported missing until close to 10.00 p.m. that night. If Madeleine McCann's pyjamas were not in fact abducted, then nor was Madeleine McCann.


Yes indeed.

So you know they were not abducted for a fact then poster?  Where is your proof please.

I am actually shocked that over the road Verdi seems to have had a revelation and agrees with me saying much the same as I have Shocked

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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  Freedom on Thu 02 Aug 2018, 10:53 am

Goodness - here's Verdi's post!

Verdi wrote: 

Size is relative - in short, if the cap fits wear it!   Too much wishing based on fabricated information. such a familiar pattern seen over the past 11 + years.

To put it simply, why would the McCanns promote the nightwear Madeleine was wearing when she was abducted - it doesn't make any sense.  If Madeleine was abducted then her nightwear was abducted with her,  would the McCanns be so crass as to draw attention to the pyjamas as those she was wearing when abducted?

As much as I respect the diligence of Dr Martin Roberts over the years, I think this particular issue is more wishful thinking, or exaggerated hype than factual information.  It's a theory based on a personal perception but appears to have been taken as gospel by the hungry onlooker, just how many similar situations have been witnessed over the past years?  If the content suits your own particular mindset then it's gospel, if it doesn't then it's open to discussion and/or criticism, or even total dismissal - the latter being my position.

Back to basics - the original  image of the pair of pyjamas under such close scrutiny, according to the European Press Agency, clearly shows a background of dark grey textured cloth, NOT blue which so much of this conspiracy has been built on, leading to the belief that the photograph was taken in Ocean Club apartment 5a.  It would appear someone was making mischief when the image morphed from a grey to blue backcloth.

Maddie's jammies?  Hogwash, there is no proof this was ever said - just more media hype emanating from team McCann.

The McCanns European/North African tour, seemingly organised by Clarence Mitchell and associates, was just a show.  It had no substance or purpose, a publicity exercise pure and simple.  The publicised pyjamas represented abduction - problem being Madeleine was most definitely not abducted, a show to fool the masses and it worked with great eclat.  Kate McCann's bewk followed the same pattern as regards media hype.
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  candyfloss on Thu 02 Aug 2018, 11:48 am

Goodness indeedy!

I bet someone is not amused Smile

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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  Freedom on Thu 02 Aug 2018, 11:59 am

I sometimes wonder if there's more than one person posting as Verdi. 

How anyone can think that they were the pyjamas actually worn by Madeleine when she was supposedly abducted, and not a similar pair produced as an example, I don't know.
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  poster on Fri 03 Aug 2018, 3:06 pm

candyfloss wrote:
poster wrote:Brilliant. Dr Robert's is so perceptive and a great writer.

Madeleine was not reported missing until close to 10.00 p.m. that night. If Madeleine McCann's pyjamas were not in fact abducted, then nor was Madeleine McCann.


Yes indeed.

So you know they were not abducted for a fact then poster?  Where is your proof please.

I am actually shocked that over the road Verdi seems to have had a revelation and agrees with me saying much the same as I have Shocked

No idea. I am just quoting Dr Robert's theory. I know nothing as fact. Dr Robert's has advanced a theory that Madeleine's pj's may not have been taken which I find interesting.
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  poster on Fri 03 Aug 2018, 3:10 pm

Freedom wrote:I sometimes wonder if there's more than one person posting as Verdi. 

How anyone can think that they were the pyjamas actually worn by Madeleine when she was supposedly abducted, and not a similar pair produced as an example, I don't know.

If Dr Amaral's theory is correct, then this raises a question of what Madeleine was wearing when she was last alive.  And whether she remained in the same clothing after she died.

I doubt very much that the McCanns told the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth with regards to what Madeleine was wearing 'when she was taken'. Presumably, they want to promote their version of 'the truth'.

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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  poster on Fri 03 Aug 2018, 3:26 pm

Freedom wrote:I sometimes wonder if there's more than one person posting as Verdi. 

How anyone can think that they were the pyjamas actually worn by Madeleine when she was supposedly abducted, and not a similar pair produced as an example, I don't know.

I think Dr Roberts has given quite a good analysis of why they might not have been Amelie's pyjamas. And Kate does say that they are actually the ones that Madeleine was wearing when she was abducted.

Why didn't she just say something like Madeleine was wearing pyjamas that resembled these? They are too big to be Amelie's pj's and I think Dr Roberts has demonstrated why the pj's would have to have been purchased the year before - the button details - when they would have positively swamped Amelie.

There are those who suggest that the McCanns gave out 'clues' and 'warnings' - perhaps the pyjamas were such an exhibit? Everything is done for a reason with the McCanns. For what purpose did they exhibit these pyjamas if we are to subscribe to Dr Amaral's theory?  If Dr Amaral is right then it was not for the purpose of finding Madeleine.
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  poster on Fri 03 Aug 2018, 4:02 pm

I've just read the LaidBare blog which appears to rubbish Dr Robert's analysis. I don't necessarily agree with either analysis and I don't agree with some of LaidBare's critiques.

For instance, how do we know that the pyjama's that Kate held up were Amelie's? Kate states they were Amelie's but that does not mean they were. They look far too big to be Amelie's. Why didn't Kate - assuming whe really wanted to find Madeleine (ahem!) just hold up a pair of pyjamas identical to the one's worn by Madeleine? In other words do what the police did and get an identical pair from M&S?

In the context of a police investigation involving a child disappearing in mysterious circumstance - quite possibly stolen by paedophiles according to her very own parents and some of their friends - then WHY ON EARTH hold up a pair of Madeleine's sister's pyjamas? Knowing full well that the 'abductor' could easily be watching and knowing full well that the abductor is still 'out there'? How could Kate be sure that 'the abductor' would not return and steal Amelie, especially as Kate has helpfully exhibited Amelie's pyjamas to the whole world?

Given that Madeleine has allegedly been stolen from her bed wearing these pyjamas, would you really want to demonstrate that you are still dressing her sister in the same pyjamas that must by now have such awful connotations?

I mean, WTF?

The police did the right thing by getting an exact copy from M&S of the pyjamas that Madeleine was allegedly wearing when stolen. But how inappropriate of Kate to hold up a pair of Madeleine's sister's pyjamas as an 'exhibit'? As stated above, they look FAR too big to have been Amelie's.

If there is any merit in the suggestion that the photo taken of the pyjamas on a blue background shows them to be damp, could they then be the pyjamas that Kate washed earlier on Thursday? The pyjamas that Kate claims had an unexplained stain on them? Which might be something to do with 'the abduction'?

All very strange.

IMO
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  joyce1938 on Sat 04 Aug 2018, 11:18 pm

There has been a lot of info regards the Pajamas maddie was or wasnot wearing when she went missing.I have wondered if she wasn't wearing those ones here sister has too.When the chap appeared to say ,after all this time ,I might add.That it was him that jane tanner saw walking across top road .I believe the pyjamas he produced at this time ,and his clothes he was wearing,well the p j s,really did not resemble the pyjamas we have all thought she must have been wearing when she went from the apartment ,I can recall my instinc right away said to me ,they are not what we all think she was wearing ? the bottoms looked like a much thicker material ,was that man telling us truth ? was it really him that jane tanner felt she saw? Did she see him ? the thing I feel is ,those jammies did not look the same as supposed to have been. It has stayed with me now for ages ,just want to know if anyone else feels this way ?joyce1938
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  Crackfox on Sat 04 Aug 2018, 11:50 pm

Hi Joyce I agree with you and what concerns me is KM's laissez-faire attitude to the description given by her friend which clearly doesn't match the actual pyjamas they claim Madeleine was wearing when she went missing. The drawing of 'Tannerman' shows him carrying a child with pyjamas that are full length. The pyjamas held up by KM are three quarter length and as the legs are wide they would easily ride up, meaning Madeleine's entire lower leg would be uncovered. This would have made an impression as the odd way of carrying and bare legs would have looked odd and not very paternal IMO. Yet the McCanns were happy for a very misleading image to be widely circulated. It's as if they knew it was of no consequence and getting the detail right didn't matter.
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  poster on Sun 05 Aug 2018, 12:29 am

bluebell wrote:Not sure if this is relevant here, but concerns clothing and I've always thought it strange..  




Processos Vol III

Pages 560 -561

Witness statement

Vera María Mestre Fernandes Arez


Date: 2007/05/08

Occupation: Laundry Worker


Place of Work: Ocean Club

She has worked at the Ocean Club for six years with the function of cleaner in the rooms and apartments of Waterside Village and for the last 4 years her function is laundry worker. Her working hours are from 09.30 to 13.00 and from 14.30 to 18.00. The laundry, her place of work, is situated in the Ocean Club Gardens.

That as laundry worker her functions are to wash, dry all the linen from the rooms and apartments (sheets, towels and clothes from some of the clients) and from the Ocean Club restaurants (towels). All the laundry work takes place in the laundry where she works with three colleagues.

That she knows about the situation that occurred in the Ocean Club since 04/05/2007 at 09.30 as she was informed by a colleague from the laundry that a child had disappeared.

That she does not know the circumstances in which the girl disappeared only having heard about it in the press and from colleagues.

That she remembers that on Saturday 05/05/2007 having washed clothing belonging to the missing girl’s family and she checked that it was children’s and adult’s clothing. This service was carried out by her colleague Silvia Cravinho. That on the next day Sunday it was her colleague Bernadete Calado who went to deliver the clothing directly to the missing girl’s apartment.


That before that no clothing from the missing girl’s family had been washed and after that date there was no other washing of clothes from the family.


That she never had any contact with the family or with the missing girl as she never leaves the laundry except to have lunch.

So - according to the McCanns and their family and friends - Madeleine was 'abducted' from the apartment by a person or persons unknown. The parents claim that 'the abductor' might have tried to drug not only Madeleine but also the twins on the night of the alleged 'abduction'. Kate in her book also insinuates that the abductor might have tried to sedate Madeleine the previous evening (the stain on the pyjamas) and I assume that might mean the 'abductor' had also tried to sedate the twins the previous evening. The implication being that the 'abductor' was thwarted on Wednesday evening but successful on Thursday evening.

Given that 'the abductor' is assumed to have entered the apartment on two evenings and is assumed to have tried to sedate Madeleine and the twins on one if not two evenings then logically one might expect clothing and bedding to have some DNA evidence of the 'abductor'.

Yet the parents make sure that clothing - including children's clothing - and bedding is washed two days after the alleged abduction - on the Saturday.

I mean WTF?
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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  dogs don't lie on Sun 05 Aug 2018, 10:10 am

joyce1938 wrote:There has been a lot of info regards the Pajamas maddie was or wasnot wearing when she went missing.I have wondered if she wasn't wearing those ones here sister has too.When the chap appeared to say ,after all this time ,I might add.That it was him that jane tanner saw walking across top road .I believe the pyjamas he produced at this time ,and his clothes he was wearing,well the p j s,really did not resemble the pyjamas we have all thought she must have been wearing when she went from the apartment ,I can recall my instinc right away said to me ,they are not what we all think  she was wearing ? the bottoms looked like a much thicker material ,was that man telling us truth ? was it really him that jane tanner felt she saw?  Did she see him ? the thing I feel is ,those jammies did not look the same as supposed to have been. It has stayed with me now for ages ,just want to know if anyone else feels this way ?joyce1938


Deffo Joyce, how on earth did they get round that one I don't know. Those pjs aren't even close to what Madeleine was described to be wearing.

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Re: PYJAMAS (Madeleine's) and other clothing items

Post  poster on Sun 05 Aug 2018, 9:29 pm

Pyjamas are clearly very important to the narrative. I think there are likely to be several different sets of pyjamas that might be important.

1. The set that Madeleine might have been wearing when something bad happened - I theorize that this was prior to the raising of the alarm on Thursday evening.

2. The set that Madeleine (or whoever was supposed to have been seen being 'abducted') is supposed to have been wearing when she was 'abducted'.

3. The set that - if Dr Amaral's theory is correct - she might have been wearing when she died.

As I think it is likely that, if Dr Amaral's theory is correct, Madeleine would have been 'laid to rest' then this also begs the question of what she might have been wearing then. I know that sounds macabre but Dr Amaral believes that Madeleine died that week and the parents and friends faked an abduction and then hid the body. The logistics involved in such a course of action are considerable and this was a large group of people in close proximity to each other and also to other people.

My mind boggles, as it so often does with this case.
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