Re: GONCALO AMARAL WINS APPEAL! - HE MAY SUE THE McCANNS

Andrew Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:09 pm

Echo that, GB.

A great and spot on post.

Mo Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:10 pm

They just can't stop!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccanns-parents-threaten-legal-7797363

costello Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:11 pm

Mo wrote:I'm sure I've read somewhere today that the reason the Appeal Court took so long was because the Macs/Duarte appealed against one of the judges who was dealing with the appeal. Apparently the judge (can't remember her name) also sat on the appeal for Snr Amaral's book which was overturned.

Yes Mo, the judge was Catarina Manso, she was the judge in GA's original court case, where he won. Hence the reason Isabel Duarte appealed against CM sitting on his appeal, this seemingly added a further 2 months to the appeal being heard.

Mo Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:13 pm

Thanks Costello I thought I'd seen it somewhere but couldn't remember where.

Mo Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:16 pm

This is a good read including comments:

https://www.craigmurray.org.uk/archives/2016/04/the-strange-case-of-gordon-brown-and-the-mccanns/

Andrew Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:23 pm

Mo wrote:They just can't stop!

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccanns-parents-threaten-legal-7797363

Blimey - so if buy the book, then got Kate on the case.

Will buy lots so won't have Kate on my case..... maybe.

Kate - just own up for god's sake.

Disgrace.

Mo Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:29 pm

On CMoMM RD Hall has posted a video of Clarence Mitchell on Comscon Austraiia. he has highlighted the lies told, unfortunately I don't know how to copy over but RD Hall would like it copying far and wide.

Dee Coy Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:29 pm

I don't get this. If the book is permissible in Europe, why not the UK?

How can they sue anyone for selling this in Britain? Dr Amaral has won his appeal. Are these empty threats made to scare publishers or is there a legal reason I don't know about?

Mo Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:32 pm

From what I remember while the book was being sold in Europe it was not allowed to be sold here. Do you remember Amazon received a letter from CR with regard to Pat Browns book, in fact I think PB received a letter also.

Neveronasunday Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:45 pm

Dee Coy wrote:I don't get this. If the book is permissible in Europe, why not the UK?

How can they sue anyone for selling this in Britain? Dr Amaral has won his appeal. Are these empty threats made to scare publishers or is there a legal reason I don't know about?

Because England is covered by English Law, Portugal by Portuguese Law.

froggy Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:46 pm

They are really just threats, but I think UK booksellers are wary of litigation, so tend to fall in line, rather than take up the challenge.

**Freedom** Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:49 pm

Mo wrote:On CMoMM RD Hall has posted a video of Clarence Mitchell on Comscon Austraiia. he has highlighted the lies told, unfortunately I don't know how to copy over but RD Hall would like it copying far and wide.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zzikQRswVpw

**candyfloss** Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:51 pm

Not the way to go I'm afraid, imo it will certainly lose them more and more sympathy.

They have in the past used PR firms to get the public onside, however, there isn't the money there now for that, I wouldn't think - it should be for searching) and I don't know how much their benefactors are willing to chuck at them.

The book is available on the internet at loads of blogs to read freely, by stopping people buying it here all they are doing is creating more animosity towards them, and curiosity to read the book. imo.

Neveronasunday Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:52 pm

The problem in England is that the onus is on the author of a book like this to prove the claims in it, or it is potentially libellous.

In other countries the burden of proof lies with the subject to disprove the claims before libel can be considered.

I'm not an expert on Portguese law but the appeal court appear to have concluded that Amaral is entitled to an opinion.

The same reasoning won't apply in the UK, so don't expect to see a translation of the book in the shops any time soon.

Mimi Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:53 pm

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccanns-parents-threaten-legal-7797363

Can they do this ? Who the bl**dy h*** do they think they are.

Neveronasunday Wed 20 Apr 2016, 8:57 pm

Explained on the main thread - in England the book would probably be considered libellous because the claims in it haven't been proved.

The law is different in Portugal.

**candyfloss** Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:03 pm

Neveronasunday wrote:Explained on the main thread - in England the book would probably be considered libellous because the claims in it haven't been proved.

The law is different in Portugal.

Hmm, how to win friends and influence people. They are certainly not endearing themselves to the public, and any sympathy that was there is ebbing away pretty fast. People don't like being threatened, and people should be able to read something available elsewhere.

They would have to take it to the courts, costing lots of money, test English law on a book written based on the investigation and the lead detectives theories, and the files which are already published and out there for all to read, and hope that they win, but of course, they could lose. Anyway, think it is a moot point because no one will publish it here!

Dee Coy Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:06 pm

Neveronasunday wrote:The problem in England is that the onus is on the author of a book like this to prove the claims in it, or it is potentially libellous.

In other countries the burden of proof lies with the subject to disprove the claims before libel can be considered.

I'm not an expert on Portguese law but the appeal court appear to have concluded that Amaral is entitled to an opinion.

The same reasoning won't apply in the UK, so don't expect to see a translation of the book in the shops any time soon.

But the 'claims' in the book are merely the findings of the police case. The book is essentially a precis of the publicly available files.

I'm guessing the book is as permissible here as it is anywhere else, the problem is getting anyone brave enough to publish and be damned. I imagine it is threats such as this made tonight that is stopping this, rather than anything contained within. I imagine the fear is compounded by the knowledge that there appears to be considerable establishment support historically for the McCanns - but is that still the case? My guess is that potential publishers will shrug and think 'Why take the risk?'.

**candyfloss** Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:08 pm

Mimi have merged your thread here as already being discussed here.

Mimi Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:11 pm

ok Candyfloss, thanks.

AndyB Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:13 pm

candyfloss wrote:The book is available on the internet at loads of blogs to read freely, by stopping people buying it here all they are doing is creating more animosity towards them, and curiosity to read the book. imo.

Absolutely. It's a well documented phenomenon known as The Streisand Effect
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Streisand_effect

Neveronasunday Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:14 pm

English Law would require the writer of such a book to prove the claims in it if they are prejudicial to the reputations of the subjects.

Since they have not been convicted or even charged with anything, it is almost certain that a libel case in England against the book would succeed, whatever any of us may think might have happened.

However, I don't understand why they pursued Amaral with such vigour - if they had let the matter drop it would largely have been forgotten by now, especially as the UK media did everything they could to discredit him.

costello Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:17 pm

It's on twitter that it is just scaremongering. I think another 'own' goal might just be in the offing, with a bit of luck.

Dee Coy Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:18 pm

Mimi wrote:http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/madeleine-mccanns-parents-threaten-legal-7797363

Can they do this ? Who the bl**dy h*** do they think they are.

My thoughts exactly, Mimi. How dare they try censoring the British public.

We need a powerful publisher - perhaps American? - to publish over here with the financial clout to fight off any potential litigation. Then we would see how strong or empty are their threats. Ain't going to happen, though. Crying or Very sad

**candyfloss** Wed 20 Apr 2016, 9:19 pm

If they are being advised it is bad advise, if they are not, and it is their own idea, then they should get advice Smile

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GONCALO AMARAL WINS APPEAL! - HE MAY SUE THE McCANNS