General Election Discussion - before and after the event

Great front page...

http://news.sky.com/story/labour-meets-to-agree-election-manifesto-after-draft-is-leaked-10872367





Brilliant!!

People loving it, the hashtag is alight..

https://twitter.com/hashtag/LabourManifesto?src=tren

Marcus English‏ @bicester_marcus · 6m6 minutes ago
 
£10 min wage, ban on zero hr contracts, rail nationalisation, free school meals, worker's rights. Common sense policies. #LabourManifesto





Tracy Wheeler‏ @TracyWheelie · 7m7 minutes ag
 
Superb #LabourManifesto, truly progressive and far preferable to ripping foxes to bits. Corbyn's our man. #VoteLabour





David Carr‏ @BeGoodBeBrave · 10m10 minutes ago  
 
Relentless political bias against #LabourManifesto #r4today & John Humphries shows establishment terrified! Sacrificing  journalistic values






Social security and pensions at a glance..

Pie in the Sky .And who is he going to borrow the money from to do this. Labour's common theme: Borrow borrow borrow - "There's no money left "
Tony Blair destroyed the Labour party and Jeremy Corben isn't the man to put it back together again, even his own party knows this.

Disagree Winslow Boy, they have the Tories running scared and half the media, they are all at the biased reporting.  They are worried and so they should be.



Mark!!!‏ @nottheothermark · 4m4 minutes ago  

Christ, the Tories really do have @BBCNews running scared, don't they? Seriously biased reporting of #LabourManifesto.





On the other hand we have     .....

Joe‏ @MrJoeGooch · 14m14 minutes ago  


BREAKING: Tory manifesto leaked!

Winslow Boy wrote:Jeremy Corben isn't the man to put it back together again, even his own party knows this.

How come they've elected him leader then? Twice. With huge majorities each time

candyfloss wrote:
http://news.sky.com/story/labour-meets-to-agree-election-manifesto-after-draft-is-leaked-10872367





Brilliant!!

People loving it, the hashtag is alight..

https://twitter.com/hashtag/LabourManifesto?src=tren

Yep brilliant. I would go back to Labour - I was a member until they didn`t put their foot down with immigration and promoted Remain. Jeremy Corbyn is fond of foreigners - he married one, then had an affair with one (Diane Abbott). I agree with everything else he promotes but NOT immigration. I think there`s only one way the vote - as this election is just about Brexit. The EU heirarchy would make mincemeat of Jeremy I`m afraid. He`s too nice. Once we`ve left the EU I`ll go back to Labour.

I don't understand at all, I thought the Tories and Cameron were dead against Brexit, and isn't this the reason Cameron left office because he didn't believe he could lead us out..  So why on earth is Theresa May preaching to us about leaving when her party was all for staying, have I got something wrong somewhere?  She has made this the main election issue, it is a load of rubbish.. she thinks by saying this she will get the votes as the majority wanted to leave.  I believe she has made a huge mistake thinking she is home and dry.

Anyone who will not debate on live TV with other leaders is to my mind a coward and cannot obviously answer questions for fear of saying something out of place.  When she refused to do this she went down in my estimation 100 per cent.  She also cannot be trusted, she went back on her word about not calling an election.

Must.....resist.....getting.....involved.....

I did notice, well most of us did, that Theresa May didn`t join in the campaigning for Remain - she vaguely did but not as if she meant it. So did she really want to leave?

I think she believes in democracy and believes she must lead where the people voted - her own views don`t come into it.

As regards the going on TV and having a spat, I think it`s just demeaning theatricals. I feel differently to you Candy - she actually went up in my estimation for keeping out of those degrading spats. They`re like cock fights. Maybe she`s not good at arguing - it gets quite nasty and is uncalled for. You get some people that can spit out words like an automatic rifle - like for example Emily Thornberry and it just becomes an attack - Theresa May is not like that and is more thoughtful and considered.

I don`t believe in her politics but I believe she will be good at negotiating. If Jeremy Corbyn was the negotiator we would leave the EU with still a free trade deal and still free movement of people and still paying in.

People watch those televised debates in their millions, it is the way many learn of the policies and what the others are campaigning for.  Many of the British public can't be asked to read all the bumph, half of it slanted and spin  anyway, so it is no wonder.  The televised debates get the message out to the public, those to scared to take part should not be leading the country.

unreorganised wrote:Must.....resist.....getting.....involved.....

Jump in you know you want to.
I've been a Trade Union man all my life and still am. But the Conservatives for all their faults make money, yes for themselves but we get the benefits as well.
I can remember no jobs, litter and rubbish piled up down the streets. Strikes, power cuts the list goes on and on.Yes you could leave your door open, because nobody had anything worth stealing.Lino on the floors if you were lucky, coal fire and we sometimes lit it when it got really cold. Labour Governments don't know how to make money they borrow it and can't pay it back. Then came Thatcher, after Labour had virtually destroyed this country. I don't care what you say about her, she dragged this Country up from of it's knees and made it great again.People could buy their own homes, furnish them, buy a decent car and so could their kids. There was no more can I borrow the car Dad, they could get their own. People no longer had to save all of their lives to afford the decent things in life, they could have it now. And yes it became a buy now pay later society, but the flip side was scrimp and save like our parents did and have the nice things when they were old. How many saved all their life only to be too old or dead to enjoy it.
Thatcher put this Country back on the map, and she had real back bone, ready to defend this great Nation. Tony Blair did what the Americans told him to, WMD, didn't find any. He was told of WMD by Bush , even his own MPs didn't want us to be part of it. And still he sent our troops without the equipment that they needed  into somebody else's war. Our brave Boys and Girls fighting a war that they should have been no part of. And where did that leave us after his escapades. Ask the parents of the dead. And when the shit started hitting the fan, he ran away and left Gordon Brown to carry the can. Tony Blair  didn't know how to make money for any body other than himself, neither did Brown, so he started selling off what assets were left. Labour once again destroying this Great Country. And we all remember the note Labour left when the Conservatives got back in  " There's no Money Left "    So once again the Conservatives had to bring this Country off it's Knee's. And yes they had to make cuts, because Labour had left us, once again, virtually bankrupt.
And now we have Jeremy 'Peace Man' Corbyn, a man even his own people tried to get rid of and still would if they could. He couldn't make money if he worked at the mint. It will be borrow borrow borrow, look at the people backing him, they can't even work out the cost of more policemen, and you want to let them run the economy. I'm not telling you to vote Conservative, but don't vote Labour. Labour can't count, but your vote can.

candyfloss wrote:People watch those televised debates in their millions, it is the way many learn of the policies and what the others are campaigning for.  Many of the British public can't be asked to read all the bumph, half of it slanted and spin  anyway, so it is no wonder.  The televised debates get the message out to the public, those to scared to take part should not be leading the country.

Don`t think it`s because she`s scared Candy.  Those televised debates show nothing except who is the most quick witted and who can fire words most aggressively - not a talent one would want for a leader.  A leader should be wise not necessarily articulate and able to shoot the quick repartee.  I`d prefer someone more thoughtful and considered. The Eton boys had all the flannel, the quick repartee that they were indoctrinated with at Eton and Oxford etc - they learn how to debate.  But this does not equal wisdom - just look at the dickhead things Boris Johnson is coming out with recently.

I don`t know why I`m defending Theresa May - I`m so anti her politics - it`s just I think she`s the best person to tackle the bullying EU jerks in Brussels.  Once we`ve got our borders secure, I`m back with Jeremy Corbyn, if he`s not been outed by then.

Of course if she doesn`t agree on a Brexit that secures our borders I will be the first one to be condemning her.

Winslow Boy wrote:

unreorganised wrote:Must.....resist.....getting.....involved.....

Jump in you know you want to.
I've been a Trade Union man all my life and still am. But the Conservatives for all their faults make money, yes for themselves but we get the benefits as well.
I can remember no jobs, litter and rubbish piled up down the streets. Strikes, power cuts the list goes on and on.Yes you could leave your door open, because nobody had anything worth stealing.Lino on the floors if you were lucky, coal fire and we sometimes lit it when it got really cold. Labour Governments don't know how to make money they borrow it and can't pay it back. Then came Thatcher, after Labour had virtually destroyed this country. I don't care what you say about her, she dragged this Country up from of it's knees and made it great again.People could buy their own homes, furnish them, buy a decent car and so could their kids. There was no more can I borrow the car Dad, they could get their own. People no longer had to save all of their lives to afford the decent things in life, they could have it now. And yes it became a buy now pay later society, but the flip side was scrimp and save like our parents did and have the nice things when they were old. How many saved all their life only to be too old or dead to enjoy it.
Thatcher put this Country back on the map, and she had real back bone, ready to defend this great Nation. Tony Blair did what the Americans told him to, WMD, didn't find any. He was told of WMD by Bush , even his own MPs didn't want us to be part of it. And still he sent our troops without the equipment that they needed  into somebody else's war. Our brave Boys and Girls fighting a war that they should have been no part of. And where did that leave us after his escapades. Ask the parents of the dead. And when the shit started hitting the fan, he ran away and left Gordon Brown to carry the can. Tony Blair  didn't know how to make money for any body other than himself, neither did Brown, so he started selling off what assets were left. Labour once again destroying this Great Country. And we all remember the note Labour left when the Conservatives got back in  " There's no Money Left "    So once again the Conservatives had to bring this Country off it's Knee's. And yes they had to make cuts, because Labour had left us, once again, virtually bankrupt.
And now we have Jeremy 'Peace Man' Corbyn, a man even his own people tried to get rid of and still would if they could. He couldn't make money if he worked at the mint. It will be borrow borrow borrow, look at the people backing him, they can't even work out the cost of more policemen, and you want to let them run the economy. I'm not telling you to vote Conservative, but don't vote Labour. Labour can't count, but your vote can.

It`s good to hear people`s perspectives.

The pattern repeats throughout recent history :-

The Tories rescue the economy then
Labour spends it all and borrows more

BUT one could say, for a good reason.

Labour sticks up for the working class, the public sector workers, the under-class, the vulnerable and disabled. They support people who are not able to make money.

Tories stick up for the business men, the bankers, the elite, the titled, the landowners, the property owners, the rich, the privileged classes.  They support people who make money.

It`s good there are the two polarities acting like a balancing of the see=saw.

I don`t know why I`m defending Theresa May - I`m so anti her politics - it`s just I think she`s the best person to tackle the bullying EU jerks in Brussels. Once we`ve got our borders secure, I`m back with Jeremy Corbyn, if he`s not been outed by then.

That's my problem too, Mimi. There can be no doubt that she'll be the best - by far - to get us a good deal with the EU. But after that there will be more cutbacks for the NHS, schools (except her treasured grammars) and those poor souls who've already had so many benefit cuts.

I must say that the leaked Labour Manifesto is encouraging and maybe will help Corbyn limit his loss. But I think he'll undoubtedly go. David Miliband would be a good replacement IMO.

candyfloss wrote:
http://news.sky.com/story/labour-meets-to-agree-election-manifesto-after-draft-is-leaked-10872367





Brilliant!!

People loving it, the hashtag is alight..

https://twitter.com/hashtag/LabourManifesto?src=tren

Bloody outrageous! Leaked today!

Such common sense which has stricken the fear of God into the Tories and all who rely on them shoud've been leaked weeks ago.

Mind you, those who have listened to Corbyn and not just read the hysteria in the RW media knew this was coming. Let the people see for themselves without prejudice. Some hope of that, though

I'm rapidly approaching my sixtieth (Saturday) we are mortgage free,don't owe any one any thing,gave both daughters the opportunity to go through uni one is the other chose a different path,we are comfortably off,I've yet to work out since leaving school at the age of fifteen whether what ever I've achieved is because of the policies of the government at the time or in spite of them.

espeland wrote:

I don`t know why I`m defending Theresa May - I`m so anti her politics - it`s just I think she`s the best person to tackle the bullying EU jerks in Brussels.  Once we`ve got our borders secure, I`m back with Jeremy Corbyn, if he`s not been outed by then.

That's my problem too, Mimi. There can be no doubt that she'll be the best - by far - to get us a good deal with the EU. But after that there will be more cutbacks for the NHS, schools (except her treasured grammars) and those poor souls who've already had so many benefit cuts.

I must say that the leaked Labour Manifesto is encouraging and maybe will help Corbyn limit his loss. But I think he'll undoubtedly go. David Miliband would be a good replacement IMO.

Leaked the Manifesto but no explanation of how he's going to do it.
Remember the vote promised on the EU by Blair in his Manifesto. Look it up along with the Lisbon Treaty.Didn't happen


Remaniac Sneering Tony Blair sparks outrage for suggesting Brits should have SECOND EU referendum

The ex-PM incurred the wrath of Brexit campaigners after insisting Britain 'should keep its options open'
by steve hawkes
4th July 2016, 12:39 am
Updated: 4th July 2016, 11:48 am


SNEERING Tony Blair sparked fury yesterday by hinting Britain should be allowed a second Referendum because people are entitled to change their minds.

The former PM, who famously ducked a national vote on the EU when he was in No10, bizarrely insisted the country “should keep its options open”.

Tony Blair
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Blair faced cheek … the former PM sparked fury yesterday by hinting Britain should be allowed a second Referendum because people are entitled to change their minds

The Remain backer said: “Yes the Referendum expressed the will of the people but the will of the people is entitled to change.

“It wasn’t 70-30, or 60-40, it was 52-48.

“Let’s be very blunt about it — some of the claims made for the Brexit case somewhat collapsed even in the week since we’ve been doing this.”

His extraordinary outburst followed a march by 30,000 “Remain” fans at a rally in London, with some chanting: “Fromage not Farage.”

And it comes just days after the ex-PM’s former chief of staff urged political leaders to be “courageous” and re-run the vote.

But Mr Blair was immediately slapped down by Brexit campaigners.

They said they would have been “laughed out of town” if they had called for a second chance after losing.

People power … Blairs outburst followed a march by 30,000 “Remain” fans at a rally in London, with some chanting: “Fromage not Farage.”

Labour MP and Out campaigner Gisela Stuart told The Sun: “The establishment just won’t accept the result.

“It’s people who don’t want their lifestyle changed complaining bitterly and sneering at people who, with nothing left to lose, voted to take back control.

“If we had lost and called for a second Referendum people would have laughed at us and called us bad losers.

“Imagine if it was a General Election.

“What’s the Tory majority, 12 seats?

“Does anyone question that?

“Do people trust that outcome?

“Yes they do.”


No turning back … Labour MP and Out campaigner Gisela Stuart told The Sun: “The establishment just won’t accept the result.”

Others accused Mr Blair of patronising the electorate and claimed it highlighted why voters had become fed up with modern-day politics.

Tory MEP Dan Hannan said: “This is why people dislike and distrust their politicians.

“MPs voted to give us a Referendum and more Brits voted to leave the EU than have voted for anything ever.

“Now Tony Blair and his henchmen are trying to overturn the result.

“They think people were too thick to get it right.

“In fact, people knew exactly what they were voting for.”

He said: “Already Project Fear is falling apart.

“All that talk of emergency Budgets and bombs under the economy has dried up.

“The voters were right and Blair was wrong — again.”


Culture of lies … Tory MEP Dan Hannan said: “This is why people dislike and distrust their politicians.


David Cameron didn't want to leave the EU, but credit to him he kept his pledge. The vote went against him and fair play to him he couldn't carry on with it as he knew that would not sit right with the voting electorate, and so resigned. Total respect to the man in this instance.
Up steps Theresa May, carrying on the will of the people. Could have carried on as is, but she wasn't voted in as Prime minister. She has now stood tall and called a General Election.
Tony Blair just passed his job onto Gordon Brown. A man unelected by the electorate.The same as the non-existent vote on the EU that his Labour Government pledged to do.
Who out of the Conservatives and Labour stuck to their pledges ?
Welcome back to Democracy the Tories are giving power back to the people. The EU vote alone in or out was a massive decision. Remember the Tories let us decide. And now Theresa May has the courage to call a General Election letting the people decide again.
As Mimi said Labour supports people who aren't able to make money. Therefore they support themselves and with somebody else's money, the Tories can only bail them out so many times. If Gordon Brown had won the Election where would he have got the money from to look after the NHS, the sick the lame and vunerable ? Everybody thought he would join up with Nick Cleggs Mob. He would have loved to have remained in power, but he couldn't because there was no money left. Labour had once again failed.
Corbyn has already shown the door to people who don't agree with him. Theresa May has shown her strength of character and integrity.

candyfloss wrote:Disagree Winslow Boy, they have the Tories running scared and half the media, they are all at the biased reporting.  They are worried and so they should be.



Mark!!!‏ @nottheothermark · 4m4 minutes ago  

Christ, the Tories really do have @BBCNews running scared, don't they? Seriously biased reporting of #LabourManifesto.





On the other hand we have     .....

Joe‏ @MrJoeGooch · 14m14 minutes ago  


BREAKING: Tory manifesto leaked!

People are waking up. Raising their bowed heads.

This is why I like this site, we all have different opinions and are allowed to give them without personal attack. Love the I disagree remark, polite and you respected my point of view as I respect yours.

Spot on, Winslow! Democracy in action, this site. And all thanks to Candy and Freedom. 

I'm blushing again!

Thank you WB and DC.

Dee Coy wrote:Spot on, Winslow! Democracy in action, this site. And all thanks to Candy and Freedom. 

Agreed.

I love to hear other peoples` perspectives - cos I know I`m not always right - nor is anyone for that matter.

One thing that has made me reconsider voting for Jeremy today is that he has denounced Theresa May holding hands with Trump/America.

I have long wished we could detach our allegiance to the American bully boys of the world. I now have to prioritise this wish with the wish to reduce immigration. I do not want to be friends with America and I hate the power of NATO - in this I think I`ll have to add my allegiance to Jeremy.

http://news.sky.com/story/corbyn-paints-may-and-trump-as-the-real-coalition-of-chaos-10874311

The manifesto states traditional Labour values eg free education, support NHS which I very much agree with. I cant understand why so many MPs cause him trouble and do not support him. What are they doing in the Labour Party? I am considering voting Labour but want to see his detailed costings of the Labour programme.

PS I wonder how the Mccanns will vote!