The Mystery of Corrie McKeague

Still no news yet then? That 24 hr stuff must've elapsed now.

Weird as you say announcing something like that in advance.

TheTruthWillOut wrote:

Andrew wrote:Still no update as yet from the Uncle on FB. Intrigued to know what he'll say

TTWO, or anyone else, can you post it up when it comes through as about to pop out shortly for a bite to eat.

Cheers.

Sure will, Andrew. Got to say I don't like how these updates are announced in advanced (reminds me of something..!?) as there could be a break at any time.

I might post a couple of theories of mine as well.

I'd be very interested to read your theories TTWO. I do feel Andrew's thoughts make sense. This reminds me very much of Adrian Lynch's disappearance, such a sad outcome there.

Adrian Lynch...Didn't that turn out to be a cock up by Jersey police?

Anyway the update from Tony is late as usual (why even announce in advance then?) and think if it happens it will be in the small hours as they tend to post late at night.

Two simple theories of what happened based on the info publicly released:

1, Corrie is still drunk when he goes out of sight of the CCTV and ends up climbing in a bin for more sleep and ends up in a bin lorry (not necessarily the one that is known about but possibly a later one)

2, A car was parked near the bins that was missed by the only camera with a direct view of the area and Corrie voluntarily or not leaves in this car again with the camera turned away. From there anything could have happened.

3, Possibly some combination of 1 and 2 above.

We are missing so much information though so really pointless going any deeper right now. It is clear to me the police must know more than they are saying even to the family (e.g. they seem to have a narrow 03:25-08:00 CCTV window. Why?). I think only an arrest will shed light on what theory is more likely. I'm very surprised there hasn't even been any arrest(s) for questioning in this case and wonder if that could be a clue here?

Not long been in but checked the FB group out. Nothing but apart from various people falling out by the looks of it.

Not seen the bin stuff

I thought the car was ruled out. Sorry, I think it was a van actually. More

Anyway - had a more closer look on the FB stuff.

Uncle Tony with the following. But no proper update:

Tony Wringe Slightly optimistic on how quick I could get to it - update coming out as soon as I can get it done.

[i]Tony Wringe In a few days time I will take my 128th flight of the year and stay for my 141st night in a hotel across Europe & Asia, so far this year alone (no, I'm not a Pilot!). In addition to this, I have been making trips to Suffolk to support Nicola and the boys and to help with the investigation. I am very fortunate that my incredible wife Stacie and two daughters, Molly & Daisy are so supportive in helping me do this. So to the small number of people who have found it so annoying to wait for the updates, I am very sorry for your wait and inconvenience, it must have been very frustrating for you. It would appear that either I must try harder, or you must recalibrate your expectations... I'll leave that with you to ponder.

I thought he was giving the updates. Ponder?

Sounds like the chap is playing a game.

Imo, etc.

So here is the update which is quite long:

[20/11] Update:
It's been a busy week.
In the previous update I started by outlining the 3 possible outcomes that we identified from the outset. We can now provide a little more detail on each:
1. Still in the 'Horseshoe' area (The loading bay area behind the shops at the intersection of Short Brackland and Brentgovel Streets).
- An external, expert search team have forensically processed the whole area surrounding the 'Horseshoe' - above, below inside & outside.
- The Investigation team have ruled out the possibility of Corrie still being in that area. No forensic trace of his presence was discovered - that is not to say he wasn't there, just no trace was discovered.
2. Left on foot:
- The CCTV for the inner & outer camera rings surrounding the 'Horseshoe' has only been viewed until 0800hrs on Saturday 24th. It has been physically tested and proven that a person can not leave this area on foot without being seen by at least one of the cameras. Corrie is not seen leaving on foot.
- The work to view the outstanding CCTV is delayed due to resource issues (both human and technical). This is largely due to there being other major investigations in the Force area being launched (2 murders), which take priority over what is still classified as a 'Missing Person' investigation. The team continue to try and work within these constraints and are seeking to engage the services of other expert organisations to assist, but this may take some time. We can all thank our previous Home Secretary for the chronic lack of Police resources - please feel free to write to her or your local MP, the media etc. to share your views on this - we're pretty sure if she had a Serviceman in her family and he was missing, there would no shortage of resources to find them and it would be headline news everyday until they did.
- 39 People have been detected on CCTV in the 'Horeshoe' general area in the target time window.
- 16 have been positively identified.
- 23 remain unidentified.
- 9 of those who remain unidentified are described as "a person in dark clothing"
- In the next few days the Investigation Team will be making direct, TV media appeals asking the public to help identify some of these individuals.
- Many of you refer to the 'person in dark clothing' who was seen exiting the 'Horseshoe' area a few minutes after Corrie went in. This is correct. This is one of the unidentified people that will be shown in the appeal for assistance.
- Next weekend, to coincide with the Christmas market, the Police POD will return to the Market area in BSE to allow people to go in and view the CCTV themselves. We will be asking for anyone who would like to volunteer to help with handing out leaflets at the market, to let people know the POD is there.
- We will be handing out leaflets on Thursday evening at the Christmas market, volunteers welcome - please come and say 'hello' if you like.

continued from above:

3. Left in a vehicle.
- 4 vehicles are known to have been in the 'Horeshoe' area in the time window being reviewed. ALL have now been identified.
- The Bin Lorry. The bin Lorry collected 1 bin. Recycling waste. The lorry had cameras on it, but they are for viewing only, not recording. The bin it collected was weighed when it was lifted into the back, showing only 11kg of material was in it (Corrie is around 85Kg). It then drove to its next pick up in Mildenhall, then on to the recycling centre. It did pass by Fiveways roundabout at Barton Mills, but we know for certain that it did not stop at any point on its journey from BSE to the next pick up or its final destination.
- The waste is emptied out of the vehicle and then a supervised sortation process occurs. We are told that it is possible that a phone might pass through this process and be destroyed or disposed of in landfill, but we are told that a body would have been found at this point. It was decided that the amount of effort involved to search the landfill was not worth the potential return of what by then would be a physically contaminated and probably smashed phone. This is why the landfill was never searched. It is too late to search it now as there are tens of tonnes of refuse on top of the area where the phone may (or may not) be.
- This does mean that from an investigation perspective, the phone is still considered as being outstanding. So please do keep on the look out for a black Nokia Lumia, it was in a black case at the time.
- The phone pinged the micro-mast at Barton Mills. This only means that it was within Broadcast range of the mast. Due to time proximity, it does seem most likely that the phone was in the Bin lorry, but that is not certain. It could have been in another vehicle and possibly on an entirely different road - I'll share the mast broadcast radius as a comment in this post.
- Investigations into the other 3 vehicles from the 'Horseshoe' continue. Speculation about them would not be helpful at this stage. There is no need to speculate further on a 'silver car' at this point either.

Thanks for posting that update TTWO. So, The Horseshoe was a very busy area then - 39 people in that time frame.
It clearly leaves 14 images (I'm excluding the ones "in dark clothing") that could be Corrie?
They need to get this CCTV out into the public asap imo.

bluebell wrote:Thanks for posting that update TTWO.    So, The Horseshoe was a very busy area then - 39 people in that time frame.
It clearly leaves 14 images (I'm excluding the ones "in dark clothing") that could be Corrie?
They need to get this CCTV out into the public asap imo.

Well I wouldn't say particularly busy, bluebell. I'd wager the vast majority of these people were staff going to work (Greggs, McDonalds, Market traders etc) closer to 08:00 on a Saturday.

The key here for me is this:

Many of you refer to the 'person in dark clothing' who was seen exiting the 'Horseshoe' area a few minutes after Corrie went in. This is correct. This is one of the unidentified people that will be shown in the appeal for assistance.

If this isn't Corrie in a change of clothes (some have theorised this) and he really did come out a few minutes after Corrie went in then this is where the investigation should have started. That the police haven't even mentioned this person up to now has got to be questioned.

Based on this new info a simple theory of events can be imagined:

Corrie is called into the bin area by this man as he walked past.
A altercation occurs leading to Corrie's death (forensics not finding anything doesn't mean much)
His phone dumped in the recycling bin picked up at ~04:00 and Corrie in a general waste bin picked up at end of trading Saturday (for example)

It still leaves a few questions like him being missed by staff filling the bin up or on bin lorry cameras and even at the incinerator site where general waste goes to.

The other option is one of the cars identified but we don't have any times of when and exactly where these were in relation to Corrie in the bin area at 03:25.

Apart from all this I don't understand why all info we are getting is from the family in dribs and drabs. Why are the police not saying anything? Lack of resources isn't an excuse...

Cheers for the updates, TTWO. I just had a quick look as well now on the FB group. Lots of comments and not read them all but pinched this map from it. Will come back to it later.

'I BELIEVE HE'S STILL ALIVE' Corrie McKeague’s mum Nicola Urquhart tells of her ‘living hell’ since RAF gunner vanished

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/uncategorized/200135/corrie-mckeagues-mum-nicola-urquhart-tells-of-her-living-hell-since-raf-gunner-vanished/

So why have the Police not released the CCTV footage of the 23 unidentified people seen in this 'horseshoe' area...

I genuinely don't understand that unless they know a lot more than they're letting on of course.

ETA - I think they're showing the footage back end of the week to locals. Setting up a 'hub' or a 'pod' or something?

Here's a brief condensed summary of the latest update from the Find Corrie website:

3 possible outcomes have been identified from the outset. We can now provide a little more detail on each:

Still in the ‘Horseshoe’ area (The loading bay area behind the shops at the intersection of Short Brackland and Brentgovel Streets).
Left on foot
Left in a vehicle

It has been 58 days since Corrie vanished. It is entirely out of character.
The family, the RAF and the Police Investigation team, none of us believe Corrie disappeared by choice.
Corrie is not still in the last place he was seen on CCTV.
Corrie did not leave that area on foot before 0800hrs 24/09.
There are only 4 vehicles that were in the area before 0800hrs 24/09.
Of the 16 people identified, who were in that area at the same time – none of them saw Corrie.
8 weeks later, there are still 23 unidentified people who were there. Somebody knows something

Andrew wrote:http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-suffolk-38052508

The uncle of a missing serviceman has criticised a "lack of police resources" available to search for his nephew.
Tony Wringe said police were yet to identify 23 people spotted on CCTV in connection with the disappearance of Corrie Mckeague.
He said it was "apparent" that Suffolk police did not have the "resources they need".
A police spokesman said work "continues to identify" those captured on security cameras in Bury St Edmunds.
For more on this story and other Suffolk news
Image caption
Corrie's uncle Tony Wringe said he had faith in the leading inspector, but said he needed more resources
Mr Wringe, who has a background in counter-terrorism, said: "I have a lot of respect for the DI leading this investigation; I think he is competent and determined to bring about an outcome.
"But he is doing this without the resources he needs to get there. I can see his frustration."
He added: "If this was Prince Harry, who is just another serviceman, then police and every other agency would be involved."
Mr Mckeague, originally from Dunfermline in Fife, was last spotted on CCTV walking alone and eating takeaway food in Bury St Edmunds at 03:20 BST on 24 September.
He was seen going into the "Horseshoe" area, a loading bay area close to Brentgovel Street, and not seen coming out again.
Image caption
Mr Wringe said it had been "tested and proven" that no one could leave the Horseshoe area on foot without being picked up by CCTV
Mr Wringe said it has been "physically tested and proven that a person cannot leave this area on foot without being seen by at least one of the cameras".
A police spokesman confirmed that 23 people were yet to be identified from CCTV footage.
The individuals are seen walking in either Brentgovel Street or Short Brackland between 03:00 and 08:00 on 24 September, police said.
The spokesman said: "Police have seized 1,100 hours of CCTV footage and work continues to identify these individuals.
"We would continue to ask anyone who was there to come forward."

Sadly police resources,as are most things in this world are finite every officer with a case to investigate would like more resources

Another contradiction:

One of the possibilities - He left on foot.

Said elsewhere:

Mr Wringe said it has been "physically tested and proven that a person cannot leave this area on foot without being seen by at least one of the cameras".

An update on the Corrie facebook from his mum, Nicola:

Nicola Urquhart
1 hr
HELP NEEDED.
On Wednesday and Thursday this week the police pod will be back in front of McDonald's in Bury town centre. The CCTV of the unidentified 23 people will be shown. Please come down and have a look. I desperately need your help. If anyone would like to help me hand out leaflets and encourage people to step inside and view the CCTV please just pop down at anytime. Anyone that has information but is worried it might not be anything important please come down and talk to me and the police, it just might be that little bit of information that brings Corrie home.
Thank you all so so much for your continued amazing support x x x

I still can't fathom why the Police have not released this CCTV footage earlier on this Corrie stuff.

And then I read this about an unsolved case 8 years ago - where they have now decided to release the CCTV footage to 'catch the killers'

8 years later.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3959964/Detectives-hunting-killers-father-battered-death-tried-break-pub-brawl-eight-years-ago-release-CCTV-final-moments.html

Andrew wrote:I still can't fathom why the Police have not released this CCTV footage earlier on this Corrie stuff.

And then I read this about an unsolved case 8 years ago - where they have now decided to release the CCTV footage to 'catch the killers'

8 years later.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3959964/Detectives-hunting-killers-father-battered-death-tried-break-pub-brawl-eight-years-ago-release-CCTV-final-moments.html

I think that's a bit different, Andrew. The attack wasn't caught on camera. A wall of silence is a tough nut to crack.

In the case of Corrie there are a number of people (and cars possibly) on camera that haven't come forward in 8 weeks. Why the police are so reluctant to release the footage is anyone's guess. They seem determined to only grudgingly show the footage locally at a "hub" in the centre of town.

Seems to me that the family and police are at loggerheads as to what they think happened reading between the lines. e.g. family insist third party involved, police think he climbed in bin and died accidentally or think he's gone AWOL.

Uncle Tony has even said the three outstanding cars have been identified. I can only surmise that means the police know who the owners are so why not pull those in for questioning instead of just asking the locals to come and view CCTV footage?

Is this another case that can be added to the "mystery" pile?

I certainly get that impression as well about the family and the Police. Come to think of it I get the very same impression with the Needhams and the McCanns being at loggerheads as well with SYP/OG respectively.

I think it certainly warrants a place in the 'mystery' pile.

I've certainly hit a dead end with it all but I still stand by my original hypothesis - wandered, collapsed, died, undiscovered.

Will see what comes out of all this 'hub' carry on that's been delayed then.

Andrew wrote:I've certainly hit a dead end with it all but I still stand by my original hypothesis - wandered, collapsed, died, undiscovered.

Will see what comes out of all this 'hub' carry on that's been delayed then.

I would agree except Tony has said tests have been done with the more than a dozen CCTV cameras in the area (timing/views etc) that proves he couldn't walk from where he was last seen without being caught on one. The only issue with this is that it isn't clear if these were police tests or something he/family have done. I assume the former but the police haven't confirmed this.

Like I say the family seem to be fixated on only one possibility - he left the area in a vehicle. Other suggestions have been (nicely) dismissed. e.g he changed clothes off camera and the man seen coming out of that small area minutes later is him.

Scratching head is about right with the hub. Apparently Corrie's mother has said if they get nothing from the hub viewings the police will "look into" showing them publicly/online!?

Regarding the CCTV stuff, then I was under the impression that it was himself and perhaps a few of his 'intelligence' pals carrying it out. Now I'm sure the Police have done the same tests - well you'd think they would - but so far they have neither confirmed or denied Tony's conclusion on that. So I find it a bit inconclusive at the moment to take what he says as gospel without further proof (sounds like another familiar Tony).

And as you say it does sound a bit odd that the family are only fixated on that possibility of theirs.