Doubts on Mrs Fenn's statement?

If it has in fact been held back surely that speaks volumes IMO.

Thanks RD, I've heard that said before but never read about it, does anyone know where I can read about it?

The statement to the the Windsor Police is no where to be seen because CTF never gave one, as the PJ files clearly show.
It was given to the Leicestershire Police and is an important difference for reasons which will become clear
But obviously certain posters feel the need to disparage Mrs Fenn at every opportunity.

Of the people who have lied without doubt and it can be proven without doubt like, Lori Campbell, Fiona Payne and certain members of the Leicesteshire Police, not a word.  How strange!

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id222.html

Jane tanner rogatory.....

agree with her.”
4078    “And from the comments amongst the group, how were the other children doing?”
Reply    “Yeah fine, yeah they were, they were tired. I think the Wednesday night, there was one night when Ella had a complete meltdown and sort of, she’s not sort of a tantrumy child but she was so tired she just sort of crashed and screamed during bath time. I think that might have been, I’m not sure if that was the Wednesday, it could have been the Wednesday but she just had a complete, you know how the kids do when they’re tired, complete meltdown and there’s screaming and they’re so tired it was quite hard to settle her but then she just, she just crashed, but there was, I think that was the Wednesday night that she, I mean by, when we were playing in the play area she sort of lay on the floor and started, which she doesn’t do at all so we knew she was, we knew she was shattered at that point. But I think that, I think that was the Wednesday.”
4078    “Okay. There seems to be nothing left then but to move on to the Thursday.”
Reply    “Mm.”

The reply to "let's move on to the Thursday" is priceless......"Mm"

Ah thanks Bampots, she doesn't seem sure of what night that was, maybe Wednesday, I thought she might be trying to account for the Tuesday night crying but seems all the crying was on the Wednesday. Mrs Fenns statement still quite damning in my eyes though.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CAROL_TRANMER.htm

Here is Carole Tramner's rogatory of 22 April 2008. In it, it makes referernce to her statement of  8 May 2007, taken when Leicestershire police visited her at work. However, this statement of 8 May 2007 does not appear in the files. Is it one of the withheld documents?

Another thing which is peculiar is Carole goes into a detailed description of the location of her aunt's flat in the block.  She is adamant Mrs Fenn lived on the third floor. This would be the top flat, not the middle floor directly above 5A. Carole describes it as the top more than once. How could she get this so wrong?

Or is she right and Mrs Fenn was directly above 5A, just not on the level above but 2 floors above 5A? The crying must have been very loud.

http://ownersapartments.co.uk/view/123

Hmm, appears some OC apartments are duplexes. Could Mrs Fenn's be on both the second and third floors? Could explain the discrepancy?

Dee Coy wrote:http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CAROL_TRANMER.htm

Here is Carole Tramner's rogatory of 22 April 2008. In it, it makes referernce to her statement of  8 May 2007, taken when Leicestershire police visited her at work. However, this statement of 8 May 2007 does not appear in the files. Is it one of the withheld documents?

Another thing which is peculiar is Carole goes into a detailed description of the location of her aunt's flat in the block.  She is adamant Mrs Fenn lived on the third floor. This would be the top flat, not the middle floor directly above 5A. Carole describes it as the top more than once. How could she get this so wrong?

Or is she right and Mrs Fenn was directly above 5A, just not on the level above but 2 floors above 5A? The crying must have been very loud.

She also described the flat where the man came out of as being on the first floor when it was the ground floor. Obviously doesn`t know what level floors are described as, even though she`s not unintelligent having worked in Windsor Castle library.

Americans call the ground floor the 1st, the 1st floor the 2nd and so on.

I know she's not American but maybe she uses the same terminology.

JJ wrote:The statement to the the Windsor Police is no where to be seen because CTF never gave one, as the PJ files clearly show.
It was given to the Leicestershire Police and is an important difference for reasons which will become clear
But obviously certain posters feel the need to disparage Mrs Fenn at every opportunity.

Of the people who have lied without doubt and it can be proven without doubt like, Lori Campbell, Fiona Payne and certain members of the Leicesteshire Police, not a word.  How strange!

She told Windsor police initially then was passed on to Leicestershire police,either way there is no 8/05/2007 statement to be seen.

Or could this be the terminology used by the Portuguese? Either way, the third floor is not directly above the ground/first floor.

One good thing,disagreements with out a hint of blue.

CT'It is in the Ocean Club, but she...

DC1485'How long has she been there, in that apartment'

CT'When my uncle died, they had a villa close to Lagos, but when he died of Alzheimer's, she sold it to buy the site in Luz. She bought it because it was surrounded by people and it was easy for her to come and go as she did not want a big site. She bought it in 2003'since 2003 and it is the second or third floor, I am never certain, but I believe that there is one more apartment

DC1485'ground floor... ground floor, first floor'

CT'No, she is the third, I believe that she is on the third floor.

DC1485'Third floor.

CT'There is only one on top, therefore, she is on the third floor, at the end apartment. Once there, you take the elevator or the stairs. There is no other entrance or exit. You go directly to her door. She lives at the end. There is no other access.

DC1485'Therefore, when one leaves the elevator, to which side does one walk, left or right'

CT'You turn left.

DC1485'Sure.

CT'You walk, as it is a long corridor. It is open at the back part, it is an open corridor open in such a way one can see the front because the back part, if you can call that part which is turned toward the pool, but the front part of the building, is in truth the back of the same. Does this make sense'

DC1485'Yes, that makes sense.

CT'Because this is the entry, the only entry point and exit point, after this there is only the veranda and the terrace and nothing more. It has been there since 2003.

DC1485'And when you enter, give me a description of the apartment.

CT'I will describe what one sees when entering. Well, when one enters there is a small entrance hall where you find her room and the living area. After, there is one more room on the opposite side of the small veranda. It is not really a veranda but a passage where one can walk; there is a window and an entrance door. This window is normally covered by a closed blind because it is the guest room; after that is a front door in such a position'the window is there and the door and when one enters there is an access door to the to the guest room and after, her room, which is at the edge of the building.

DC1485'Yes.

CT'One passes through there and there is a bathroom and through the entrance hall there is a guest room, a kitchen and an eating area. After the living area, there is a big open terrace'where we would usually go. It is completely open.

DC1485'When you are on the terrace, to which direction are you turned'

CT'We are turned to a beautiful view of the ocean and all the clay roofs of the village, where one can see the pool, the reception area, the pool zone, the tennis courts, and one could see the roof of the Tapas bar. There are trees and bushes between all of this, so when one looks out, there are only roof tops, the small homes and other villas. It is an incredible view.

DC1485'Who else lives there'

CT' Actually, she is the only resident, which may seem strange but she wants to be there. So she is the only resident. All the other owners, the majority of them, more or less, are people who acquired the apartments and rent them or else use them only for holidays. For this reason, there are times in the year when she is alone.

DC1485'And who else lives with her'

CT' She is completely alone.

DC1485'Alone.

CT' No one else.

Mimi wrote:

Could that be a duplex?  Possible. No mention of it being a two-floored apartment in her statement, though.

CT'There is only one on top, therefore, she is on the third floor,

It`s so confusing. But I gather from her saying there is only one on top that she is in the middle.  It`s her saying it`s the 3rd floor which counters everything.

IMO it is not a duplex - she doesn`t describe any stairs to another floor. Anyway she would end up with two balconys at the back overlooking the sea - I doubt that`s the case.

Quick q can anyone shed light on this part of Mrs Fenn's statement?

She did not have anything to report for the 2nd May, because she was only home at night.

Russian Doll wrote:  Quick q   can anyone shed light on this part of Mrs Fenn's statement?

 She did not have anything to report for the 2nd May, because she was only home at night.

Socialising? she didn't need to account for her movements,but just as easily could she have mistaken which day her niece took her out.

There is a photo of Mrs Fenn going into her apartment directly above 5a, and also another of her on the balcony.

Yes, McCanns on the ground floor, Mrs Fenn on the first and the Moyes on the second floor - the Top flat in that part of Block 5:

Radio interview with Susan Myes confirming their residence, and that Mrs Fenn lived below them:

https://madeleinemccannthetruth.wordpress.com/2011/10/24/radio-stoke-speak-to-susan-moyes/

SUSAN MOYES Directly above. We are but one above. Mrs Fenn who lives there was in the apartment below us and then below that was the McCanns. So directly above.

This thread from CMOMM sheds a lot of light too - it appears the 2 apartments in the middle on the 4th floor are the duplexes:

http://jillhavern.forumotion.net/t4236p20-carole-tranmer

caricature wrote:

candyfloss wrote:@mimi,

I don't think it matters what age you are Mimi, if bedlam is going on beneath you I think perhaps you would want to know what was happening?

You would especially lean over your own balcony rather than go down, for fear it may be dangerous.

I'm sure I've seen somewhere its almost impossible to look over the balcony to below.

Knew I'd seen something.

DC1485'Then it was not a specific look below, we will call it a glance.

CT'Yes, yes, it is very difficult to see below. One only had a general view.

Sorry if this is a bit off topic but I'm really interested in more information on Reading man.

Sequence of events of CT arranging interview and being seen by mysterious Reading man.

1, Called Windsor Police, Told they'll get her the number for LP. (Didn't receive return call?)

2, Passed by Windsor squadron but no one there so called LP directly herself.

3, Told LP everything and they said they'll call back.

4, DC1485 Messiah contacts her directly. He arranges interview with CT.

5, After interview with Leic/Windsor police she receives call from someone in Reading (police? MI5/6?) asking her to help produce a identi-kit.

6, CT reserves another room for the young, short, computer genius from Reading and helps to produce sketch on Laptop.

7, DC Messiah shows CT a sketch that wasn't the one she made with Reading man.

Later in the rog, DC Messiah mentions a name: Tasmin. CT doesn't recognise this name.

Also I know there have been questions of how long Mrs Fenn had been in Portugal/Apartment in Luz.

CT states that her aunt has been in Portugal for 20-30 years and in the Luz apartment since ~mid 2003.

Question: Who is the guy from Reading and has there been any discussion about it before?

CT states that her aunt has been in Portugal for 20-30 years and in the Luz apartment since ~mid 2003.

Seems along time for not to be able to understand Portuguese.

Being of British nationality and in spite of living in Portugal, does not have knowledge of the Portuguese language in its oral and written form, therefore a police interpreter is present,