Capabilities of the Dogs

For me this would have to happen when no adult was present, otherwise there's no need to fake anything. Some believe the children were never left unattended, so that would rule this scenario out. GA seemed confident it was accidental and at the couch though, and tbh, he's the one I'd trust.
IMO

candyfloss wrote:

chirpyinsect wrote:If we can't be sure of the blood being Madeleine's but trust that a cadaver was in the apartment, is it now possible to think that there is an alternative scenario? That instead of being taken out of the apartment, her body was brought in. The lack of dna, bed unmessed, no sheets on cots,Oldfield describing the wrong apartment, cuddlecat not on high shelf might point to them having lived elsewhere and used 5a to stage the abduction from. Might explain the creche sheets fiasco as names and locations were switched around.

Mrs Fenn knew there was someone letting the apartment below..  The cleaner cleaned the apartment, and a cleaner saw them.  I'm afraid a pre planned event with having another apartment, changing crèche records, telling witnesses to lie, is way beyond the scope of my imagination, too many people, too much planning, how did they manage to get 5a if they lived elsewhere?.  I think MO maybe described his own thinking it was the same, as he never went into the bedroom did he IIRC?

Didn't Mrs Fenn say she never heard them down below?


When questioned, she said that she never heard any arguments between the couple or with their children. She said that the family would spend much time outside of the apartment and therefore she did not notice their presence.

Thank you, CI, but that has already been dealt with. See a couple of comments above.

ETA and just saw your comment above :-)

Neveronasunday wrote:That is an interesting thought

If you are prepared to reconsider the evidence behind the sofa, ie that it must have been the scene of death, it opens up many new possibilities because the timelines are altered

In particular, there is no need to work out if a body could have been lying in situ long enough to develop cadaver scent on the evening of 3 May - something that has been a bone of contention for years

***
Where do I start?
My thought was based on the fact that there's no dispute about Eddie finding cadaver scent in the master bedroom.
Hence my mind wandered to other options, which in fact I've been doing for the past 9 years ;-)

I do not exclude, though, that Eddie found cadaver and blood behind the sofa and Keela confirmed the blood scent. This goes with my theory, that she did indeed fall behind the sofa, where she met her faith and was only discovered the next morning.

Another odd thing about the master bedroom, is that the cleaning lady saw a cot there on Wednesday morning, whereas the parents deny that.
Strange. Why would she lie or make up a story or why would they?

I don't exclude either that she an accident whilst not being supervised, was treated by the "doctors" themselves and unfortunately didn't survive, which required yet another scenario to put in place ...

Hmmm,some one mentioned in here about cadaver alert on the veranda and the possibility of washing of cadaver onto the garden underneath,now take this from Dr Martin Roberts latest blog.

http://onlyinamericablogging.blogspot.com/2016/03/a-nightwear-job-by-dr-martin-roberts.html

There is, as we know, an anecdote of Kate McCann's, which sees her washing Madeleine's pyjama top on the Thursday morning. As re-told in her book, she does so while alone in the family's apartment:

"I returned to our apartment before Gerry had finished his tennis lesson and washed and hung out Madeleine’s pyjama top on the veranda."

For her own words that is a strange wording.  Surely you would say on the balcony, or did they have some area below?  A veranda is on the ground floor, we know their balcony was up some stairs .....


veranda

a roofed platform along the outside of a house, level with the ground floor.

It's often been called a patio too ... If you don't have them, maybe you don't know how to name them ;-)

Martin Grime describes it thus.

Veranda outside parent's bedroom.
Garden area directly under veranda.

I have a covered area at the rear of my house which I always refer to as the veranda.Bit of an oddity though in that it is on the same level as the house which is a bungalow from the front but on first floor level at the back because the ground slopes away there, making the veranda a balcony. Wasn't it sort of the same with 5a front at street level, back upstairs.

Perhaps that is why the pruning?  To hang the washing without getting tangled in shrubs.  This is the small garden area below their patio...




This is a good view, of the area

There's something hanging over the railings of the balcony too!

By God - is that it?

PJs washed - but nothing can eliminate cadaverine thoroughly - dried on verandah wall, water dripped down into the flower bed?

 
clothes airer pictured on veranda/balcony courtesy of pj files.

Any idea when that pic was taken..... (of the clothing on the balcony)

A towel maybe. Not Gerrys y-fronts anyway.

A pink blanket.

Interesting Dee.

Dee Coy wrote:By God - is that it?

PJs washed - but nothing can eliminate cadaverine thoroughly - dried on verandah wall, water dripped down into the flower bed?

That's a good call, could very well account for the 'light scent' in MG's statement/opinion

Dee Coy wrote:By God - is that it?

PJs washed - but nothing can eliminate cadaverine thoroughly - dried on verandah wall, water dripped down into the flower bed?

Excellent observation Dee Coy as always. I was losing interest in this thread of late to be honest. I really think you may be on to something here.

Andrew wrote:Any idea when that pic was taken..... (of the clothing on the balcony)

A towel maybe. Not Gerrys y-fronts anyway.

A pink blanket.

Interesting Dee.

Not sure if it was taken during their stay or if taken after they moved. My guess is the latter as there was no reason for there to be photos before the event. So anything hanging there may not be theirs. I need new specs as I can't see anything on the railings.

We need to establish a date for this said photo.

If it was took the morning after the blue bag was taken, then.....

Or, if was took months afterwards, then a non-starter.

I'm near sure it was taken the night she went, by the police.
Chirps, there's what looks like a child's t-shirt in the pics candyfloss posted, but I think it's not relevant cause there's no date on those.

dogs don't lie wrote:I'm near sure it was taken the night she went, by the police.

Hi, ddl. It can't be taken before the 3rd. It can't be taken straight after. As would be dark.

The next morn or anytime afterwards...

That's why it would be good to verify exactly.....

Andrew wrote:

dogs don't lie wrote:I'm near sure it was taken the night she went, by the police.

Hi, ddl. It can't be taken before the 3rd. It can't be taken straight after. As would be dark.

The next morn or anytime afterwards...

That's why it would be good to verify exactly.....

Do you mean photo 14?

Err... not sure. Watching the football, but thought this was about the pic with some keks dangling over the balcony...

Sorry all. I perhaps need to start again and re-read.

Just looked. The 3 photos that CF posted at 18:33. I meant the middle one out of that.

Is that pic 14.. No idea.

Andrew wrote:Just looked. The 3 photos that CF posted at 18:33. I meant the middle one out of that.

Is that pic 14.. No idea.

This one Andrew with something pinkish hanging..






And this one of the courtyard area from above.




(Pic above) Aerial view of the courtyard area. Note: Mrs Fenn sitting on her balcony immediately above the McCanns apartment.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id129.html

dogs don't lie wrote:

Andrew wrote:

dogs don't lie wrote:I'm near sure it was taken the night she went, by the police.

Hi, ddl. It can't be taken before the 3rd. It can't be taken straight after. As would be dark.

The next morn or anytime afterwards...

That's why it would be good to verify exactly.....

Do you mean photo 14?

Hi ddl, maybe you could  ask Freedom or Candyfloss.I would also be interested in when this photograph was supposedly taken.